I went to the ducati dealership today. i was looking to get a Termignoni carbon slip on exaust system for my 696.
the guys there told me to go with the titanium instead of the carbon fiber one. now i figured they were pushing the titanium one since its about $400 more. but they said they had a few titanium ones in stock and they would give me a good deal on them. only about $75 more than the carbon ones.
now the two main reasons i was leaning towards the carbon one is because i like the carbon look (the titanium ones look basically like the stock ones with a termignoni sticker on it) & it dissipates the heat the best.
the guys at the dealership said that they would stay away from the carbon fiber exaust because in about a year they will start fading, cracking, and start looking like sh*t. they said guys come in all the time with a year old bike, and the bike looks brand new while their carbon exaust pipes look old and nasty...
any opinions which one i should get? are these guys right for the most part?
Get what You want. ;)
Quote from: kopfjager on August 26, 2008, 08:34:10 PM
Get what You want. ;)
seriously. If carbon fiber went bad in a year, you dont think there would be a public outcry on it.
Quote from: He Man on August 26, 2008, 08:36:46 PM
seriously. If carbon fiber went bad in a year, you dont think there would be a public outcry on it.
yeah honestly, i have never hears anyone say this before. that is why i was wanting some other opinions. why do you think they were steering me away from the carbon exausts?
I don't know about the 696 but the slip ons for the 1098 had cats in the titanium versions and none in the carbon. So, the dealers had plenty of titanium versions since nobody wanted them.
Because they had Ti in stock.
what they are saying about carbon is grossly inaccurate, you could also polish the Ti for a third aesthetic option...
if carbon went bad would they be making airplanes from it? It stays pretty as long as its high quality and you take care of it.
so for basically the same price, are you guys saying you'd get the carbon.
yep
I don't really like the look of carbon but I'd get that version because of the heat thing. Too many times have kids walked up to my bike and put their hand on the can before I could scare the sheite out of them. You can always have the CF refinished (better!) down the road and I doubt it would cost much more than the $75 diff. My experience with the finish on DP/Termi CF corraborates the dealer's statement in that it's not the best but I wouldn't say it'll look like cr@p in a year's time.
I vote CF, it sounds better too. The Ti systems I've heard never have the lower tones. The cf bellows like an angry bull. See my sig line. [thumbsup]
just a thought. the TI cans are emissions legal. The Stainless steel and CF cans are race only. So if your state (country) checks that. get the TI cans.
ALSO, tell me which dealer. I would rather have the TI cans since I want to go to Europe and need the emissions legal.. for the price of the CF [thumbsup]
Quote from: mrplease on August 26, 2008, 08:50:27 PM
so for basically the same price, are you guys saying you'd get the carbon.
Forget "for basically the same price", I'd be willing to pay a fair amount more for the carbon fiber.
Quote from: c_rex on August 26, 2008, 09:04:59 PM
I don't really like the look of carbon but I'd get that version because of the heat thing. Too many times have kids walked up to my bike and put their hand on the can before I could scare the sheite out of them. You can always have the CF refinished (better!) down the road and I doubt it would cost much more than the $75 diff. My experience with the finish on DP/Termi CF corraborates the dealer's statement in that it's not the best but I wouldn't say it'll look like cr@p in a year's time.
+1
I have the CF cans on my 696...I can jump off, and grab them if I wanted, only the tips get hot.
i'm trying to remember (had them on my 99 M900), but i think the TI cans dissipate heat the same way as the CF cans. (someone please chime in who has TI cans)
For those who to need to stay emissions legal, the TI cans are the only ones that can be used other than stock.
Price wise it goes
SS @900
CF @1300
TI @1600
so TIs for the price of CF is a pretty good savings. now CF or TI for the price of SS and I'd sell some stuff to get that quick.
Quote from: nkryptit on August 27, 2008, 05:07:28 AM
+1
I have the CF cans on my 696...I can jump off, and grab them if I wanted, only the tips get hot.
you have any pics?
Quote from: Raux on August 27, 2008, 05:21:22 AM
i'm trying to remember (had them on my 99 M900), but i think the TI cans dissipate heat the same way as the CF cans. (someone please chime in who has TI cans)
For those who to need to stay emissions legal, the TI cans are the only ones that can be used other than stock.
Price wise it goes
SS @900
CF @1300
TI @1600
so TIs for the price of CF is a pretty good savings. now CF or TI for the price of SS and I'd sell some stuff to get that quick.
the guys at the dealership said that the titanium does dissipate the heat. but not as good as the carbon fiber ones...
I agree that the statement about them looking ratty in one year is a gross misstatement. However, it is true that over time the Ti will hold up better than the CF. I have old Termi CF cans on my bike (maybe 6+ years old). The clearcoat has long since disappeared, the CF looks faded, and there are spots that are starting to fray from something rubbing on them. However, I got these cans for free and they were clearly abused, so who knows how long they could last if properly maintained?
The thing I definitely like about the CF, as has been mentioned, is that they don't get hot. Ti will never do that as well.
Ultimately, get what you like!
Quote from: mrplease on August 27, 2008, 05:39:26 AM
the guys at the dealership said that the titanium does dissipate the heat. but not as good as the carbon fiber ones...
I have Ti Zards and they never get more than pleasantly warm, so really, I think the 'temperature issue' they're pushing here is a spurious one.
Go for what you like the look of.
;D
...its totally understandable that a shop wants to push what they have in stock and i'm OK with it.
But LIEING about a different product?!? WTF!!! >:(
...if i were you, my friend, i would buy the CF ones (if that is what you wanted) form someone else and not go back.
The way they flat out LIED to you about the CF sais enough about them to not go back...
where do you live? TX AZ socal?...i live in LA (plenty of sun) and have had CF pipes on my monster since 2004...still perfect.
on my 998 i have pipes and all sorts of goodies in CF since 2005...still perfect...
so bottom line:
1) if you want CF dont worrie about it, just get it
2) i wouldnt go back to that shop again for nothing but a sale
ps: whats the shop?
the shop is the texas plano ducati dealership
Couple points...
I have carbon cans on my monster s4r and ti cans on my 1098s. Both dissipate the heat nearly the same. I can put my hand directly on either after riding the bike hard.
That being said, if you get the carbon cans, I would recommend bringing them to the paint shop to be UV clear coated before you install them on the bike. I did that and they look brand new, 3 years later. I have seen many CF cans that look like crap very shortly (1 year) after install.
If you love the CF look, go for it! Coat em and be done!!
Quote from: ducducgooseme on August 27, 2008, 11:01:43 AM
I have carbon cans on my monster s4r and ti cans on my 1098s. Both dissipate the heat nearly the same. I can put my hand directly on either after riding the bike hard.
+1
I had Ti cans on my M900. They never got hot either, just like my cf cans.
Get whatever you think looks better. CF does fade a bit if it sits in the sun a lot. Clear coat will solve that. My bikes don't sit in the sun all the time (Seattle...I'm not even sure the sun visits here), so my cf still looks fine.
Quote from: KEH on August 27, 2008, 06:16:11 AM
I agree that the statement about them looking ratty in one year is a gross misstatement. However, it is true that over time the Ti will hold up better than the CF. I have old Termi CF cans on my bike (maybe 6+ years old). The clearcoat has long since disappeared, the CF looks faded, and there are spots that are starting to fray from something rubbing on them.
The carbon fiber on the used ST2 tht I just bought looked really, really bad when I bought it. The front fender was milky white pitted, and the fibers of the carbon appeared to be faded in some spots. There were a couple of spots where the clear seemed to be thin and worn to the point where I could make out where the weave was showing through the worn clear. I was able to lightly sand most of the white off the clear coat, and the fender looks a bit better, but now it looks like some of the carbon weave is exposed. It will need to be reclear-coated to look good, again. The tank protector was also milky white in several areas and that cleaned up fairly well with somewet sanding.....I was informed that both of these items were Ducati Performance parts and less than ten years old.
I say buy what you want. Personally, I view carbon fiber on a Ducati like chrome on a Harley. I'm removing all the carbon fiber from this ST2 and selling it while replacing the parts with standard OEM parts. On the other hand, my wife's Monster has a carbon fiber seat cowl, carbon high-mount Termis, carbon slip-on heat-shields, and originally was supposed to have a carbon front fender and rear hugger.
What's with all the people checking to see if their exhaust is hot? Seriously-why would you grab an exhaust to check it for heat? It's asking for a burn, and even if you discover it doesn't get too warm-who cares? Do you plan on parking it up against something? Would you rig up an A/C? What am I missing here?
Quote from: someguy on August 27, 2008, 12:04:44 PM
What's with all the people checking to see if their exhaust is hot? Seriously-why would you grab an exhaust to check it for heat? It's asking for a burn, and even if you discover it doesn't get too warm-who cares? Do you plan on parking it up against something? Would you rig up an A/C? What am I missing here?
[laugh] I was thinking the same thing. Just a note, after a hard ride, my engine gets hot. Is this normal?
a lot of people carry passengers and want an exhaust that isnt hot to the touch because of that.
rear passenger comfort is the issue for me. the stock cans are awful hot for the wife. want to bring down the temperature for her... i'm the only thing that's supposed to get her hot [evil]
...i see many ducs around here and truth is, verry few have faded carbon fiber Termis...the faded ones i have seen (not many) were non Termignoni...
+1 on the clear coat, but just as an extra precaution and to extend the "bran new look"
never seen a CF pipe become crappy in less than 1y (unless it was crappy from the begining)
...FYI there are many different kinds of CF. Some weves are tighter, some are bigger, some are colored...the clear coat they put on them is what goes bad...some clear coats are, already when new, yellowish...(i think 2 bros or D&D carbon fiber is coated with a wellowish clear when new...)
Termignoni weve is the tightes i have seen, the clear is clear and it hold age pretty damn good.
On the other side, Ducati Performance parts are probably the worst i have ever seen. The weve is wide, the fibers are lighter and look as they are faded from the get go, the clear is not as good as aothers....it goes yellow much faster...
...that being said last time i bought a DP carbon part was 2 years ago so maybe they have changed ;D
ps: ask then why they are willing to take 325$ off the Ti and nothing off the CF ;D
Quote from: ducducgooseme on August 27, 2008, 12:28:07 PM
a lot of people carry passengers and want an exhaust that isnt hot to the touch because of that.
a lot of people whant to be able to fry their bacon on their pipes for a snack hence an exhaust that is hot to the touch because of that.
I have no good reason. :P I just wanted to see if the cans were hot. I don't always think through my actions. [laugh]
Big mistake on the 848 with stock cans containing a catalytic converter. [bang]
i have a question for anyone who has the 696 with the termignoni carbon exaust.
can you put the carbon gaurd/protectors on them? the guy at the dealership said they can only be put on the stock exaust. but i've seen pictures of the 696 with the carbon exaust with the gaurds...
Gots the carbon Termis on my S4 for just over a year and closing in on 7,500 miles. The carbon looks just the same as it did when wheeling it out of the showroom. As stated earlier, the are IT for heat dissapation, I can place my hands flst on the carbon part of the pipe anytime, sitting in traffic or wherever, they are just warm.
My Sil Moto CF cans are six years old and just now starting to get a bit cloudy - I couldn't be more pleased with them. And I think I have the best sounding motorcycle on the planet . . . ;D
Quote from: Desmo Demon on August 27, 2008, 11:32:18 AM
It will need to be reclear-coated to look good, again.
DD, are you going to clear coat yourself or send it out someplace? I've been wondering how to keep mine looking good, I'd rather be on the preventative side if possible. There are no pits or mars in the weave or finish, it just almost looks a bit . . . dusty.
I have Ti cans and like others with Ti cans have stated, they dissipate heat just fine. The only other talking point I can offer up is that Ti, at least on my pipes, scratches pretty easily. If you're particular about little scratches then you need to be a little more careful pulling into tight places around the garage or where ever to make sure you don't brush up on something that could scratch them.
My observation is that more people rock carbon than Ti so I'm happy with my choice. But I think carbon looks hawt too so what do I know. At the end of the day, you stare at your bike more than anyone so get what pleases you. [thumbsup]
b.
Quote from: b. on August 27, 2008, 04:47:58 PM
... I'm happy with my choice.
most important part of the decision! [moto]
thats for all the suggestions and opinions people...
i've got one more question though.
does anyone have the termignoni exaust on their 696? either carbon or ti. i'm trying to figure out if the carbon exaust shield/gaurd will work with them.
If you are concerned about heat and the titanium cans have cats like the 1098 then don't use them.
Quote from: sully749 on August 27, 2008, 01:44:55 PM
DD, are you going to clear coat yourself or send it out someplace? I've been wondering how to keep mine looking good, I'd rather be on the preventative side if possible. There are no pits or mars in the weave or finish, it just almost looks a bit . . . dusty.
If I were to opt to keep the fender, I'd reclear it with some two-part, Dupont, automotive clear that I have, but instead, I'm selling the fender and some carbon heel guards to a paint and body guy who wants them for his '99 ST2. I'm sure he'll use a good quality clear and prep the parts really well. I have heard from some people
When I bought my first Monster in '01 (S4), all I could find were titanium slip-ons. So, I bought some from Two Brothers Racing.
They were great pipes and sounded great, but when I compared the sound to others who had the same bike with carbon slip-ons, I liked the sound of the carbon slip-ons better. It's hard to describe, because the sound was close between the carbon and ti. But the carbon slip-ons were... boomier (is that a word?). Or maybe 'thumpier' (still not a word).
I wanted to switch over to carbon, but come on, at some point you HAVE to stop spending money on the damn bikes and just ride them!
I'm looking at pics of the DP exahusts and it doesnt look like they have the mounts for the heat shields.
yeah i know. its weird because in my 696 accesories brochure it has a 696 with the carbon exaust system and the head shields on them...
One thing that hasn't come up is repacking carbon exhaust to prevent discoloring and extend the life of the cans. If you don't repack a carbon can
the fiberglass that lines the can will break down and eventually hot gases will have direct contact with the carbon, not a good thing. If you repack the carbon cans should last a long as metal. If your not into pulling your cans, apart get Ti or even Al. Repacking is an easy but dirty job.
OK found it... this is from the factory and the CF should have the mounts for the shields... cool detail is the CF shields have heat shielding on the inside.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egBR8oETjEU