so my wife and i have been discussing an upgrade to the monster next year. she says to get a bigger one and sell the one i have. however i say to keep my monster because i can use it for my commuting and the occasional fun stuff. both people i know (lisa & b) say that when they got rid of their monster they really missed it and i don't want that to happen. if i keep it i would like to get a used 748 (any color but yellow sry lyd) , 749dark or an 848( not white sry b). the bike would mainly be for trips like muenster, h/c or ok. of the three i am not sure which is the best. i really like the 749 dark. i know the 848 is prob the cheapest to maintain but i do everything except my own valves (which will prob be changing in the future). if anyone has ridden all three please let me know the differences in ergos (please remember i am 5'6" with a 32" inseam) , power app., etc. your opinions are not without merit. they will all help me make a decision for my future purchase.
Quote from: calscrazy on November 01, 2008, 01:31:25 PM
so my wife and i have been discussing an upgrade to the monster next year. she says to get a bigger one and sell the one i have. however i say to keep my monster because i can use it for my commuting and the occasional fun stuff. both people i know (lisa & b) say that when they got rid of their monster they really missed it and i don't want that to happen. if i keep it i would like to get a used 748 (any color but yellow sry lyd) , 749dark or an 848( not white sry b). the bike would mainly be for trips like muenster, h/c or ok. of the three i am not sure which is the best. i really like the 749 dark. i know the 848 is prob the cheapest to maintain but i do everything except my own valves (which will prob be changing in the future). if anyone has ridden all three please let me know the differences in ergos (please remember i am 5'6" with a 32" inseam) , power app., etc. your opinions are not without merit. they will all help me make a decision for my future purchase.
It is my belief that everyone should own a Monster and a SBK.
Your best best is prob a 749. 748-s have terrible flaking rocker problems and its kinda hard to find one with all the issues addressed for cheap...
It is hard to beat a bike with a warranty.
Quote from: Slag on November 01, 2008, 02:19:05 PM
It is hard to beat a bike with a warranty.
+1 848 all the way [thumbsup]
BTW, I don't miss not having a Monster (let the flaming begin)
+1 for El Matador. Verbatim [thumbsup]
I tend to like the last gen superbike because of their adjustability; seat/tank assembly moves forward or back on the frame, and the foot pegs have multiple adjustability... plus you can adjust the steering rake.
Of course now if I only knew how all of this could benefit me at a track day [laugh] [cheeky]
I miss my Monster but like the 848/Multistrada arrangement that I have. The Strada is an excellent around town bike and awesome in the twisties. it is a good sport tourer but not the greatest long distance/high speed highway bike(poor wind protection). My 848 is going to be limited to the track and rides in the country less than 200 miles or so round trip. I am not too comfortable on the 848 for long periods of time. I know Bryant can go all day on his 848 so it just may be an issue with an old fart like me. I love the 848 at the track.
Any of those SBKs would be great to have in the stable with a Monster. [thumbsup]
Since I've only ridden the 848 out of the bunch I can't really comment on the other options.
But the 848 does have a 32.3" seat and you'll have to buy an adjustable linkage to change that.
It doesn't come with a steering damper, if that's something you think you may want (I'm saving for these parts, triple and damper kit)
Ergo-wise, I'm pretty comfy of the bike. It took a few weeks to get used to the "crotch rocket" stance.
Ask David about his 748 if you want some really good detailed info on it. He has ridden my 848 and his 748 back to back so he might have some good comparos for you
Good luck on the hunt for a SBK!
*edit*
I reread my post and it read like it was negative on the 848. It's not, the bike is amazing, but those are some issues that I have(had) to address or get used to. The power on the 848 is great and you'll love it
As an owner of two Tamburinis and one Terblanche I would say avoid the 748s for reasons that can be discussed over beers at a get together. Looking for a nice 749 is not bad thinking at all. Better ergos than the 748 but only to a degree. Parts are no problem and neither is reliability. Also, I believe the 749 carries over the adjustability of the 999 line... I think. Good AMS question. Ask Kevin about long range 848 riding. He put a lot of miles on his on the AR ride in September. Not sure how many B8 has on his at one setting. Also not sure about the difference between the 848 and 1098 comfort-wise. I bet there is not a lot of difference. Ask Tommy, RichD and Zach about 1098 long range comfort. [thumbsup]
On any of the three bikes putting on a set of Ferracci or Heli-bars would certainly help with wrist and neck comfort (don't ask me how I know [laugh]) and they subtract absolutely zero from the sportiness of the bikes. If you are thinking of doing this next year I bet you could find a nice, gently used 848 for a good deal. 748s are around but they are not getting any younger. You know the 999s aren't any bigger or taller than the 749 and there are more of them. Just a thought. If you are worried about too much power on the 999 the throttle works both ways and you aren't talking 170hp in line four superbike here. If you catch me on mine sometime you can take it for a spin and see. [moto]
Quote from: Slag on November 01, 2008, 02:19:05 PM
It is hard to beat a bike with a warranty.
True.
Quote from: El Matador on November 01, 2008, 02:15:44 PM
It is my belief that everyone should own a Monster and a SBK.
Your best best is prob a 749. 748-s have terrible flaking rocker problems and its kinda hard to find one with all the issues addressed for cheap...
True also.
Quote from: calscrazy on November 01, 2008, 01:31:25 PM
i would like to get a used 748 (any color but yellow sry lyd) Sacrilege', 749dark or an 848( not white sry b) (White is the bomb man!!!).
i really like the 749 dark.
i know the 848 is prob the cheapest to maintain but i do everything except my own valves (which will prob be changing in the future).
Many people didn't like the 749/999 because of the style. It was different and they didn't want different. Ride a Ducati and not want different, hmm go figure. As I drooled over the Bimota DB7 and DB5 today at Eurosports, I realized that the styling had a lot of clues from the 749/999 bikes. They say, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. I happen to like the 999 style and have been tempted to my wits end to buy a cherry '05 999R that is tucked away somewhere waiting for someone to buy it.
Since you like the 749 style, you are blessed and cursed. They didn't sell a lot of those bikes so they can be hard to come by and may be more expensive because of that. On the other hand, many people didn't understand them so they may not sell well and can be had for less than expected. That is also something to consider when it is time to sell it. The DARK would have less expensive suspension components. It is unfortunate that people don't spend more on upgrading their suspension. What ever money you save, should go to freshning up you suspension. But even the DARK has the Testastreta motor a big improvement over what came before it.
The 748/916/996 has the iconic style that shocked the world during its time. It is however, relative to the 749, actually relative to all other sportbikes, a crude motor. There I said it. It does not have the finess of the 749 and the power and even more finess of the 848.
It is the most uncomfortable of the three ergonomically. Remember what they say about price of an object of desire... "if you have to ask, you can't afford it". In the case of the 748/9**, ergonomically speaking, "if you have to ask, you can't stand it". In stock configuration, I know how the 916 is to ride, I've ridden the 1098 and it is only slightly better and I am told the 999 is more comfortable. But with these bikes sad to say, you have to be, ...how shall I say this delicately, ... small of girth... or have long arms or both to have any chance at comfort. That said, who said riding an SBK had to be like a day in the spa huh? Maybe a day in the spa after the ride.
Oh and wear leathers because all three with their underseat exhaust will burn your legs and some say their bums too.
So knowing all of the above, if you want to have a bike that you don't mind tinker around with, the 748 is not a bad bike to own. Classic style, good power especially coming from a 695. The flacking rockers can be replaced. Check out Megacycle for their rockers. I am guessing it is cheaper to buy and old enough to where you can justify having the forks rebuilt and the shocks upgraded. If the bike's clutch needs to be replaced, you can upgrade to a slipper clutch. A lightened flywheel and light weight wheels would be the ticket over time of course.
Eventually, you would have to do the same with a 749 DARK mods wise, but you would have paid more upfront. You get more power though from a more efficient motor (powerwise not fuel economy wise). How much power do you really need is a question you have to answer. One major downside of the Terblanche bikes is no storage for anything ask Lisa.
The 848, newer style, warranty and more power still. Better brakes.
Finally, I don't know what the range of the 848 is between fill ups but I'm told the 1098 range is not too much above 100 miles. Maybe the 848 is better. I also don't know what the 999 and 749's range is but my 916 can go to 165 miles per tank which is not bad so I suspect the 748 can do better.
Just my 2 cents. Happy Hunting.
cdc
Chris, its okay, not everyone can look as good as me on a yellow bike!!! [laugh]
20 points for Alan's team! [laugh] [thumbsup]
Charles is dead on right about all three SBKs having BBQ pits for seats. Underseat exhausts suck. Period. For sure Patrick will point, laugh and make fun but I don't even ride my 999 during the summer. I like my ass and thighs just the way they are, not well done! Lisa will agree (999 wise) and every 848/1098 rider will also concur. Let's just face facts, it's obvious that a vegan diet is like coating your body with asbestos. The heat retardant factors of a vegetarian diet is the best kept government secret. Damn! Now they'll have to kill me!
I think you should fit on damn near everything. I'm 5'9'' or so and have a 30" inseam and I have no problems. My torso might be a little longer though. That reach to the bars may be more of a pain than the reach to the ground. Add really low bars and that could double that pain. Seriously, sit on or ride my 999 and see. It's got Ferracci bars and the "comfort" DP seat. Heck, do the same with one of my Tamburinis. They both have Ferraccis too.
Fun dilemma! [thumbsup]
Or do what Brian does,
OWN THEM ALL!
How many people do you guys know who are as generous as Brian and as importantly own the bikes that everyone wants to own?
Need to know a bout a 'busa? Here ride mine and if you still have questions, pull up a chair and I'll get the beer. ;D
A Ducati you say? Well hell boy, which one?
How about a Gixer, two flavors don't you know ...or an Eddie Lawson rep Kawi hmm?
Oh you heard about the Honda that beat the WSBK Ducati juggernaut? Yup, I have one of those too!
It would be great to be Brian but since we can't I'm just thankful we have him as friend.
Three cheers for Brian!!! [clap] [clap] [clap] [bow_down] [bow_down] [bow_down]
I know he said sit but he did say ride too didn't he? Where does the line start Brian?
cdc
(Oh, those are just the ones I know. I bet if he ever brought them all out, we'd be like little kids at a Macy's New Year's Day parade.)
CDC and I both have ST's ! Cool, power, handling, touring too, what more can you ask for?
Yeah, that's very true about summer heat and SBKs which is why having an air cooled bike to fall back on is so great. Also as others have noted, the SBK around town is huge overkill and also a lot more work than you probably want to spend recreationally; long trips out in the country or certainly at the track is where this bike shines.
Just another argument for "collecting the set" :D
Also, if you'd would like to ride my 999 sometime, you're more than welcome. It has the DP "Comfort" seat (which actually is more comfortable) but still has the stock bars. I'll have it at Hard 8 tomorrow.
Happy hunting!
so basically it's case of the 748 has rocker issues :P but good ergos and classic styling. the 749 dark (personal fav) :) will be harder to find which naturally will cost more but dont all duc's. it has ok ergos but not great and good power delivery. the 848 has the 1098 pure sex body [thumbsup] however when i sit on them i find myself really up on my wrist. the motor is great and i am starting to see alot of used ones for decent prices (most due first service or close too). having only sat on one of the three (848) i know that a big thing for me is i don't want to tetter-totter at stops and the 848 with it's 32" seat height really has me up on my tip-toes. i read where the 749 has only a 30" seat height in stock form and if it is a more level bike i wouldn't be up on my wrist so hard. i guess i could always say screw it and go ride some japanese bikes also. and just find something super comfy brand be damned ??? it prob wont be until this time next year but i just want to get a good idea in my head of what i want vs. what is comfortable (if it ain't i won't ride it and i don't need no garage queen) vs. what is good power for me. this could take awile [coffee]
you won't end up paying much more for a 999. I say go for it. the 749/999 had a motor change out in 2005/2006 that added some horsepower. The ergos on the 749/999 are WAY more comfortable than the 748/916/996/998s, and still noticeably more comfortable than the 848/1098 ( but obviously down on power from those ). My personal opinion is that it is a great bang for your buck.
Did James sell the 999 yet? that is a great deal... will need a little work, plus street prep if you want to take it off the track, but if it's not sold yet, that'd be the way to go.... maybe get a fresh set of skins, do a matte black finish, and you will have what I wanted, a 999 Dark ;)
Quote from: Sir L'Blur on November 01, 2008, 03:04:29 PM
+1 848 all the way [thumbsup]
BTW, I don't miss not having a Monster (let the flaming begin)
Shun! Shun the nonbeliever!
Quote from: cdc on November 01, 2008, 06:14:08 PM
Or do what Brian does,
OWN THEM ALL!
Now wouldn't that be nice ;D
Honestly, If you're only keeping one bike, steer clear from the SBKs. I've ridden traffic in dallas in my 996 and within minutes, the thing was overheating and spewing coolant over my right arm, plus i might never have children and if I do, they're probably gonna come out vegan or with some other terrible birth defect.
Another thing to consider is the economics of buying an older used bike are looking lot better than getting a new one (848) right now. You should scour the forums to try and find the best deals possible (ducati.ms, TOB, etc) and you'd be surprised at what you can find.
And finally, whatever you get, you have let me ride it ;D
"Honestly, If you're only keeping one bike, steer clear from the SBKs. I've ridden traffic in dallas in my 996 and within minutes, the thing was overheating and spewing coolant over my right arm, plus i might never have children and if I do, they're probably gonna come out vegan or with some other terrible birth defect." -el matador
First off, I commute on the triple 9. the leg heat is rough in summer, but it's really not that bad.
Second off, if the worst trait that your little future Chavista gets is that he is a vegan, than you are in fine shape, my friend [thumbsup]
Quote from: The Svoloch on November 02, 2008, 05:09:32 AM
"Honestly, If you're only keeping one bike, steer clear from the SBKs. I've ridden traffic in dallas in my 996 and within minutes, the thing was overheating and spewing coolant over my right arm, plus i might never have children and if I do, they're probably gonna come out vegan or with some other terrible birth defect." -el matador
First off, I commute on the triple 9. the leg heat is rough in summer, but it's really not that bad.
Second off, if the worst trait that your little future Chavista gets is that he is a vegan, than you are in fine shape, my friend [thumbsup]
[laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
If a kid of mine comes out Chavista, he is getting my size 13 shoes up his ass until he straightens out.
i am going to keep two the monster for commuting and then get a SBK for the fun stuff. i may have to reconsider the 999 if the only difference is power. i do love the dark though.
nah.... you need a 1098 ;D
how bout...........NNNOOOOO!!!! ;D
Quote from: DLS on November 01, 2008, 03:04:29 PM
+1 848 all the way [thumbsup]
BTW, I don't miss not having a Monster (let the flaming begin)
I think it should be "everyone should have a 2-valve and a 4-valve".
My 900SS and 1098S fill any requirement I have... but tweak that formula as it suits you!
For example: L'Smarts Paul Smart and 1098S [moto]
I think your Monster and an 848 would be a great choice!!! [thumbsup]
So far no mention of a bigger monster. I think my S4Rs is terrific. It has nearly as much power as the 999 (114hp at the wheel on the dyno, stock). It has full ohlins and adjustable rear ride height. After 20k miles in varied environments, you never have to worry about roasting your nuts, and you are already aware of the lack of wind protection in the winter. The only caveat is that the bigger monster has the dry clutch, which really needs an after market clutch slave for stop and go traffic.
However, it seems that what you really want is pure sex appeal, in which case I vote 848. Who cares about ergos on a bike that pretty.
Quote from: SUPER DUKE! on November 02, 2008, 05:15:32 PM
I think it should be "everyone should have a 2-valve and a 4-valve".
My 900SS and 1098S fill any requirement I have... but tweak that formula as it suits you!
For example: L'Smarts Paul Smart and 1098S [moto]
I bow in awe of SD's keen awareness and prescient insight [thumbsup]
Again, keep the 999 in mind. Like I said, there are more of those than 749s. Yes, it's a fairly flat platform unlike the nose down/tail up attitude of the 848/1098 clan. Mine is A LOT more comfy than my 916 and 996 and they all have the taller aftermarket bars on them. Nothing against the 848s! Killer looking and performing bikes but you can't hide the seat height. My inseam is shorter than yours and I have no troubles on the 999. Heck, my BinB with the comfort seat is taller than the 999! I'm biased but I think the triple 9 should stay in your race. [thumbsup] [moto]
if i get a bigger monster i would sell the one i have now. however the 999 i didn't really consider becuase i am afraid it might be to big a leap from two katana's to a 695 to a 999. but like someone said the throttle goes both ways. i would have to teach myself to resist urges one may have.
Quote from: calscrazy on November 03, 2008, 10:33:13 AM
........ i would have to teach myself to resist urges one may have.
Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated! (The BORG)
cdc
My '04 999 has 124 hp. Plenty enough to scare you good [evil]
Quote from: calscrazy on November 03, 2008, 10:33:13 AM
if i get a bigger monster i would sell the one i have now. however the 999 i didn't really consider becuase i am afraid it might be to big a leap from two katana's to a 695 to a 999. but like someone said the throttle goes both ways. i would have to teach myself to resist urges one may have.
I rode behind you for a little bit on the HC ride. You're a good rider, as long as you keep your big head controlling the little one, you'll be fine on a bigger SBK.
On a twin specially, the transition is a lot easier to handle. Since the power application is progressive and not explosive above 4k, as long as you can control your right wrist, you should be fine. It is not like riding one of the liter I-4's that seem to take off like a rocket ship as soon as you hit 9k revs.
It is actually very important that if you do get a sbk, you go to a track as soon as possible. The novice pace should permit you to gradually explore the bike and increase your comfort level with it in a safe controlled manner. It will make you much more confident with the bike, even if it seems a little counterintuitive to take a bike that you have such little experience with to the track.
Cheers and good luck with whatever you get!
Oh and, james's 999 is looking mighty purdy [thumbsup]
Quote from: El Matador on November 03, 2008, 04:42:34 PM
On a twin specially, the transition is a lot easier to handle. Since the power application is progressive and not explosive above 4k, as long as you can control your right wrist, you should be fine. It is not like riding one of the liter I-4's that seem to take off like a rocket ship as soon as you hit 9k revs.
I don't really understand that, my twins shut down at 9K. My S4R pulls like a scalded dog from 4K on and shuts down at 8.5-9K. My R1 is the easier bike to ride, you have to make it go into higher revs to get the "explosiveness". The 1098s pulls like a mofo, but it shuts down at 10k I think. I personally think the R1 is as easy to ride as a M600 monster. A I-4 600 feels slower than a 695 if you ride it under 8K rpms....
That being said, the 1098 is my favorite bike to ride, just gotta remember to ride a gear up until I learn better throttle control.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 03, 2008, 07:21:43 PM
I don't really understand that, my twins shut down at 9K. My S4R pulls like a scalded dog from 4K on and shuts down at 8.5-9K. My R1 is the easier bike to ride, you have to make it go into higher revs to get the "explosiveness". The 1098s pulls like a mofo, but it shuts down at 10k I think.
What that says is that the power curve on the twins are linear. You pull nicely from 3.5 k until you hit the rev limiter at 11k.
On the I-4's you have to get into the higher revs to produce the power, and if you're not prepared for it, the transition between being at 7k and 10k will make you hurt.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 03, 2008, 07:21:43 PM
I personally think the R1 is as easy to ride as a M600 monster. A I-4 600 feels slower than a 695 if you ride it under 8K rpms....
That's just not true dude.
Yes, if you keep an I-4 under 8k you're basically lugging the engine, but you've got another 10k before you hit the limiter. If you come into a corner in an I-4 doing 45 at 7k revs and then accelerate through the turn, you're gonna get a nasty surprise when you hit that 8.5k sweet spot and you're wondering why you've just highsided.
Quote from: El Matador on November 03, 2008, 11:25:57 PM
What that says is that the power curve on the twins are linear. You pull nicely from 3.5 k until you hit the rev limiter at 11k.
On the I-4's you have to get into the higher revs to produce the power, and if you're not prepared for it, the transition between being at 7k and 10k will make you hurt.
That's just not true dude.
Yes, if you keep an I-4 under 8k you're basically lugging the engine, but you've got another 10k before you hit the limiter. If you come into a corner in an I-4 doing 45 at 7k revs and then accelerate through the turn, you're gonna get a nasty surprise when you hit that 8.5k sweet spot and you're wondering why you've just highsided.
we can go around about this all day....I said if you keep it under 8K which, show me a M600 that you can ride above that. You just said nasty surprise at 8.5K.....last time I checked, 8.5 is higher than 8. Most people who ride Monsters, or slower twins are only used to riding between 3-8K. They have to, that's what they're limited to. I don't see most people getting on a I-4 and riding them harder than they rode their previous bike (at first). Once you get to or above 8k on an I-4 you would already be riding out of your comfort zone from your old bike (speed wise) that is why I say for a beginner it is just as easy to ride a I-4 as a V2. If someone jumps on a I-4 and hits a corner at 8k rpms and tries to accelerate through it, they will have the skill level to do it. Like I said, beginners wont do that, if they do...... well..... they should learn to ride before trying to ride hard.
I think what El Matador meant was that the twins power band is linear and more predictable whereas the I-4s are usually more top heavy and can explode when you hit the power band.
IMO, comparing engine speed between the twin and I-4 isn't the same. They have different power pulses, tons of small explosions or fewer big explosions.
Different bikes for different people [thumbsup]
Oh yeah, sorry about the threadjack
look, I'm speaking from experience only, not what I've heard from other people or read in a magazine or on a forum. I thought it was odd that he said my statement was simply not true. Like said, I speak from experience only, I've ridden gsxr 600, r6, gsxr 1000, r1, zx7r, m600, 695, 696, sc1000, ps1000le, s4r, 848, 1098 and a few cruisers. I'm merely stating my experiences, and if you ride a I-4 under 8k, it will be less torquey and feel easier to ride than a v2 at 8k. Its also built to handle better and stop more quickly. Not to mention engine torque, do you know how many times I almost bit asphalt from down shifting into a corner on a v2.... You don't have that problem on a I-4. Riding a I-4 under 8k is easier on throttle control because you aren't in your peak power like you would be on a v2. And FYI, there isn't 10k more rpms after 8k. Most 600's drop off around 14-15. Even less with the higher cc engines.
[bang] [bang] [bang]
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 06:08:31 AM
I've ridden gsxr 600, r6, gsxr 1000, r1, zx7r, m600, 695, 696, sc1000, ps1000le, s4r, 848, 1098 and a few cruisers.
[bow_down]
[moto] Wow Chris - the debate at your house is amazing ! [moto] I mention new motos I would like to have at great peril to my personal safety & always with loss of Kitchen Points (TM) by demerit ! Your woman aware of any of this discussion really ? If so, I am envious !
We recognize pregnant doges.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 06:08:31 AM
look, I'm speaking from experience only, not what I've heard from other people or read in a magazine or on a forum. I thought it was odd that he said my statement was simply not true.
I said your statement wasn't true because it isn't. Riding an R1, will never even begin to compare to riding a 600 cc duc. Granted, if you keep from being in the powerband, the R1 wont produce any real amount of HP, but unless you find a way to magically limit the bike to 8K rpm, it is inevitable to go into it. And anybody who buys a motorcycle with the express intent of lugging its engine, is a moron.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 06:08:31 AM
Like said, I speak from experience only, I've ridden gsxr 600, r6, gsxr 1000, r1, zx7r, m600, 695, 696, sc1000, ps1000le, s4r, 848, 1098 and a few cruisers. I'm merely stating my experiences, and if you ride a I-4 under 8k, it will be less torquey and feel easier to ride than a v2 at 8k.
I speak from experience as well. I have ridden a number of I-4's, from 600 cc bikes to literbikes, including an R1. In fact, my previous bike was indeed a CBR600. So I do know what it takes to ride an I-4 and what the riding experience equates to; and it is NOT the same as in a m600
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 06:08:31 AM
Not to mention engine torque, do you know how many times I almost bit asphalt from down shifting into a corner on a v2....
Maybe you should practice rev matching, or invest in a lightened flywheel. You'll see a world of difference with the engine braking, which isn't a bad thing IMHO. Engine braking allows you to have more control over how much speed you're carrying, and used properly, can be a very useful tool.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 06:08:31 AM
You don't have that problem on a I-4. Riding a I-4 under 8k is easier on throttle control because you aren't in your peak power like you would be on a v2.
If you're going to get an I-4, just to ride it under 8K, just get a twin. It is just plain ridiculous to try to compare the power produced at the same engine speeds between both bikes. They're meant to be ridden differently and if you ride a bike any differently than you should because you don't feel comfortable on it, you have no business being on that bike.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 04:57:26 AM
we can go around about this all day....I said if you keep it under 8K which, show me a M600 that you can ride above that.
Why would you need to?
And FYI, 600 monsters top out at 10.2 K
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 04:57:26 AM
You just said nasty surprise at 8.5K.....last time I checked, 8.5 is higher than 8.
And your point with this is?
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 04:57:26 AM
Most people who ride Monsters, or slower twins are only used to riding between 3-8K. They have to, that's what they're limited to. I don't see most people getting on a I-4 and riding them harder than they rode their previous bike (at first).
That's funny, really. When you change a motorcycle because you're looking for something with more power, you ARE going to try and ride the new bike past the limitations of the old one, that's why you got it in the first place.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 04:57:26 AM
Once you get to or above 8k on an I-4 you would already be riding out of your comfort zone from your old bike (speed wise) that is why I say for a beginner it is just as easy to ride a I-4 as a V2.
See above. The fact that you're advocating getting a full on I-4 literbike as a beginner bike because it doesn't produce any quantifiable amount of power outside the powerband is ridiculous.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 04:57:26 AMIf someone jumps on a I-4 and hits a corner at 8k rpms and tries to accelerate through it, they will have the skill level to do it. Like I said, beginners wont do that, if they do...... well..... they should learn to ride before trying to ride hard.
[laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
Quote from: Cyclone on November 04, 2008, 07:13:03 AM
[moto] Wow Chris - the debate at your house is amazing ! [moto]
Echo ! [cheeky]
(http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/6711/arguemnetuj1.jpg)
(http://packy.dardan.com/walky/albums/album11/afz.jpg)
Quote from: Slag on November 04, 2008, 07:54:11 AM
(http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/6711/arguemnetuj1.jpg)
(http://packy.dardan.com/walky/albums/album11/afz.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v605/lilshorty6478/arguing.jpg)
[laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
;D ;D ;D [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
TOO FUNNY SLAG - !! [thumbsup] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
I liked this one best.
cdc
(http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/6711/arguemnetuj1.jpg)
Edited to protect the tragically thin skinned. No more PM's or texts on the subject please. I didn't realize that it was your kid.
wow....people are PM'ing you.... politically correctness is a mother make the beast with two backser
I wonder if Jesus got a PM for playing Jesus in that one pic from HC.....
;D To quote DLS " Move along, nothing to see here !! " !! OOps we're at CalsCrazy's house .. he makes the rules !!
Quote from: Cyclone on November 04, 2008, 07:13:03 AM
[moto] Wow Chris - the debate at your house is amazing ! [moto] I mention new motos I would like to have at great peril to my personal safety & always with loss of Kitchen Points (TM) by demerit ! Your woman aware of any of this discussion really ? If so, I am envious !
yeah not quite as in depth. it's more my wife saying i can have one bike and she would prefer it be a bigger monster. however is say keep the monster and add a SBK. she will agree to this but she would prefer it be used don't ask why. she has been playing around on-line and found the 749, 999, and 998 matrix. her favorite would be the matrix but i think that is because she likes keanu reeves. she read reviews on the 999 where they said it was the greatest SBK built and that has her a little worried. she just doesn't want it to be something where i end up w/more bikes than i ride. NO OFFENSE BRIAN!!
Quote from: calscrazy on November 04, 2008, 09:48:42 AM
her favorite would be the matrix but i think that is because she likes keanu reeves.
[laugh] [laugh] Sounds familiar !
Quote from: calscrazy on November 04, 2008, 09:48:42 AM
she read reviews on the 999 where they said it was the greatest SBK built
Cyclonette read a moto review and get info ? That'll be the day !
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 09:26:06 AM...I wonder if Jesus got a PM for playing Jesus in that one pic from HC.....
You know -he probably did!
Holy hell chavez....... are you serious, I gotta actually respond to this?
OK here goes....
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
I said your statement wasn't true because it isn't. Riding an R1, will never even begin to compare to riding a 600 cc duc. Granted, if you keep from being in the powerband, the R1 wont produce any real amount of HP, but unless you find a way to magically limit the bike to 8K rpm, it is inevitable to go into it. And anybody who buys a motorcycle with the express intent of lugging its engine, is a moron.
I never said it compared, I said it feels easier. I believe I said "if", And I ride my R1 in town, through my neighborhood, etc... and I stay well under 8K [whisper] not magic, throttle control [thumbsup]
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
I speak from experience as well. I have ridden a number of I-4's, from 600 cc bikes to literbikes, including an R1. In fact, my previous bike was indeed a CBR600. So I do know what it takes to ride an I-4 and what the riding experience equates to; and it is NOT the same as in a m600
Who said it was the same.....just stated that they are just as easy, if not easier.....
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
Maybe you should practice rev matching, or invest in a lightened flywheel. You'll see a world of difference with the engine braking, which isn't a bad thing IMHO. Engine braking allows you to have more control over how much speed you're carrying, and used properly, can be a very useful tool.
Thanks I'll practice that. I'm just so new to riding that all this stuff is so hard to remember.
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
If you're going to get an I-4, just to ride it under 8K, just get a twin. It is just plain ridiculous to try to compare the power produced at the same engine speeds between both bikes. They're meant to be ridden differently and if you ride a bike any differently than you should because you don't feel comfortable on it, you have no business being on that bike.
I have both, but thanks for the insight [thumbsup]
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
Why would you need to?
And FYI, 600 monsters top out at 10.2 K
Most people need to ride under 8k just saying....
If the M600 tops out at 10.2k, then I stand corrected. I know the 696 peaks at 9k and the 695 peaks at 8.5k and my S4R peaks at 8.7k so I just figured it was under 9k, so I stand corrected it it does peak over 10k
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
And your point with this is?
was talking about riding under 8k, then you made an argument about riding over.........
Quote from: El Matador on November 04, 2008, 07:43:54 AM
That's funny, really. When you change a motorcycle because you're looking for something with more power, you ARE going to try and ride the new bike past the limitations of the old one, that's why you got it in the first place.
ummm.....did you miss the (at first) in my statement.
Here's the deal, I merely stated that riding the r1 is "to me" (and I think I have heard Bonwilder state the same) just as easy to ride as any v2 when you ride it in a lower rpm range. And the I-4 600's actually feel even slower when you are in lower speed areas. That's it. Not "advocating" a beginner to go buy a liter bike....... that's not smart.
who cares about a 4 vs. a twin? [bang]
donald, don't kid urself she doesn't really care about motorcycles and if she had her way there wouldn't be a one at my house. since it is an interest of mine she takes a lil' interest in it. she believes anything with full fairrings is a race bike. harleys are too loud. "why do all japenese bikes look the same" (her qoute not mine). i take some interest in some of her stuff just to return the kindness. she was wonderin what the ones i was lookin at looked like. she has seen the 848 in person at ams-a.
If you are gonna buy a Ducati SBK, I think the 848 is an awesome bike. You can buy one used that still has warranty, not sure, but I think it puts out about the same power as a 999. I personally think its better lookiing too.
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 09:26:06 AM
I wonder if Jesus got a PM for playing Jesus in that one pic from HC.....
I sent him one. [leo]
No, I didn't. ;D J/K
cdc
Quote from: pipeliner1978 on November 04, 2008, 10:33:15 AM
Holy hell chavez....... are you serious, I gotta actually respond to this?
OK here goes....I never said it compared, I said it feels easier. I believe I said "if", And I ride my R1 in town, through my neighborhood, etc... and I stay well under 8K [whisper] not magic, throttle control [thumbsup]
Who said it was the same.....just stated that they are just as easy, if not easier.....
Thanks I'll practice that. I'm just so new to riding that all this stuff is so hard to remember.
I have both, but thanks for the insight [thumbsup]
Most people need to ride under 8k just saying....
If the M600 tops out at 10.2k, then I stand corrected. I know the 696 peaks at 9k and the 695 peaks at 8.5k and my S4R peaks at 8.7k so I just figured it was under 9k, so I stand corrected it it does peak over 10k
was talking about riding under 8k, then you made an argument about riding over.........
ummm.....did you miss the (at first) in my statement.
Here's the deal, I merely stated that riding the r1 is "to me" (and I think I have heard Bonwilder state the same) just as easy to ride as any v2 when you ride it in a lower rpm range. And the I-4 600's actually feel even slower when you are in lower speed areas. That's it. Not "advocating" a beginner to go buy a liter bike....... that's not smart.
[popcorn]
.....or I could throw in my 2 cents.
hmm, maybe not.
ciao baby, (always wanted to say that) ;D
cdc
Quote from: calscrazy on November 04, 2008, 11:09:48 AM
i take some interest in some of her stuff just to return the kindness. she was wonderin what the ones i was lookin at looked like. she has seen the 848 in person at ams-a.
Thanks for that - I now completely respect your opinions about art because you can be truly honest! [laugh]
I honestly never knew many moto-women before the Forum, & no moto couples. The Moto thing has been an uphill sell for me, it helps that Cat really likes y'all, believes me when I tell her y'all look out for each other & me. It's kind of like riding with a wind instead of against one.
Whatever you pick for your new Moto ( or hopefully other moto ) some will like it, & some won't, but I think we'll all be happy for you!
Quote from: calscrazy on November 04, 2008, 09:48:42 AM
she read reviews on the 999 where they said it was the greatest SBK built and that has her a little worried. she just doesn't want it to be something where i end up w/more bikes than i ride. NO OFFENSE BRIAN!!
Tell her they lied. It's a slow, inexpensive, piece of s#@t. That way you can get one without her worrying! [thumbsup] Was I supposed to be offended? Damn I missed that one! [laugh]
Quote from: fastwin on November 04, 2008, 11:40:17 AM
Tell her they lied. It's a slow, inexpensive, piece of s#@t. That way you can get one without her worrying! [thumbsup] Was I supposed to be offended? Damn I missed that one! [laugh]
Alrighty then! Humor me while I show you my slow, inexpensive, piece of shit [laugh]
There was mention of the adjustability of a 999 (think I brought it up in fact. Hmmm, imagine that). I had my bike apart this afternoon so our very own RichD could weld up a subframe crack. While I was at it, I took some pictures specifically to show the adjustment point on a STOCK 999 frame (this will be "old news" for some, but what the hell [evil] ).
This first pix shows the bike with the rear cowl and seat section removed. Note the three holes drilled in the plate on top of the horizontal frame tube:
(http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z234/n2f/P1030506.jpg)
The postion of each of those holes locates the rear cowl/seat AND tank forward or back on the frame (i.e. closer to the front or more towards the rear).
This second picture details the two steel rods fastened to the front of the gas tank that allows the tank/seat/rear cowl section to slide forward or back on the frame:
(http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z234/n2f/P1030520.jpg)
These are the mini frame tubes where the steel rods go:
(http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z234/n2f/P1030523.jpg)
And this is a really crappy picture of what it looks like with the prongs in place in the mini frame tubes (this shows the tank/seat/rear cowl section in the postion that is as far "back" as it will go):
(http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z234/n2f/P1030525.jpg)
Of course then you've got the part of the frame where the foot pegs mount that allows twelve-way adjustability of the foot pegs:
(http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z234/n2f/P1030532.jpg)
As you can tell, I'm crazy about the 999 - great bang for the buck [thumbsup]
I think I'm voting for you! [clap] [laugh]
ty lisa. those are awesome and will definetly help in my decision making. please remember though this purchase is not spur of the moment it will prob be made late next summer or early fall i just wanted some help from folks who have been on these bikes and understand the finer differences.
That's cool - there will be plenty of good motorcycles to choose from by then too, I bet. Crazy economy :P