This is my first bike and first Ducati. I have a brand new 696 for 2 months now. I have being learning allot from this forum and is really incredible how friendly you'll are when a newbie comes in.
Since i started riding it the oil temp indicator has being climbing, at first when it reached 200 F i thought that something was wrong but then i realized that they where F and not C as the manual stated. Some weeks have passed and today it reached 472 F with 5 bars ( air temp has always being from 95 to 105 ). When it reaches to 5 bars (the day starts with 1) it gives allot of heat on my legs and knees.
Im not sure if this is common but im afraid something is going to happen to the bike.
Welcome to the board! I don't own any air cooled bikes but that does sound awful hot. You will however want to move this post over to Tech for better responses. Don't forget to introduce yourself, too! Glad you made it here. - Bill
Never seen my 696 get that hot.
^^^^^^ What's an avg. temp for that thing on a warm (85deg+) day?
Your 696 is still under warranty, I would suggest that you discuss (and put on record) your concerns with your dealer
The air temp will go from 95 to 105. Whats strange is that the oil temp keeps going up but at the start of a day the bars start in 1.
Quote from: Capo on December 26, 2008, 05:45:31 AM
Your 696 is still under warranty, I would suggest that you discuss (and put on record) your concerns with your dealer
+1
I will be going today, i'll let you know.
I thing though that i did not mention is that a few weeks ago i left the lights on all night and had to take the battery out for charging, could this be something going wrong from that? I followed the instructions on the manual step by step.
Thanks to all in advance
I wouldn't think that would have any effect at all. BTW, how was the temp before the battery incident?
I don't remember exactly but i do know that at first i got scared because after reading the manual when i got the bike i remembered that the normal temp was until the 200's C but i did not realized that my bike was in F. After i made the conversion and realized i was half way and mostly standard oil temp from what i read.
Since the first day i got it the oil temp has being incrementing with no particular speed before of after the battery incident.
What you are describing does not match at all with the 696 manual.
MAX operating temperature is 201 deg C and the display should show 7 flashing temperature bars
Are you sure the display didn't default back into deg F when you removed the battery?
J3, the display has always been in MPG and F as the main units. You are correct the manual shows >201 C and 7 bars, but it has not gone over 5 bars for me and now it shows 485, every time i ride it goes a little higher.
I dont remember if you can change the display unit, can i?
Did you buy your 696 new or used?
I suspect you bought it used.
Take your bike to the nearest Ducati Dealer, and tell them to check and see if the wires to the ignition coils are reversed.
I suspect that they are.
BC.
Quote from: deadzone on December 26, 2008, 05:01:49 AM
This is my first bike and first Ducati. I have a brand new 696 for 2 months now. I have being learning allot from this forum and is really incredible how friendly you'll are when a newbie comes in.
Since i started riding it the oil temp indicator has being climbing, at first when it reached 200 F i thought that something was wrong but then i realized that they where F and not C as the manual stated. Some weeks have passed and today it reached 472 F with 5 bars ( air temp has always being from 95 to 105 ). When it reaches to 5 bars (the day starts with 1) it gives allot of heat on my legs and knees.
Im not sure if this is common but im afraid something is going to happen to the bike.
Quote from: deadzone on December 26, 2008, 08:56:35 AM
I dont remember if you can change the display unit, can i?
Not as far as I know.
According to the manual 5 bars is "Status 6" and means the oil temp is between 161C-175C which is 322F-347F. The highest temp range is "Status 9" which is all 7 bars blinking. That would mean the bike is over 201C or 394F. Where/How are you measuring a temp of 472F?
My 696 usually has 4 bars showing and when it was hot out (90F+) it would show 5 bars. If I'm understanding your post correctly, it's 95 - 105 degrees Fahrenheit outside when you are riding. Which means that 5 bars would be about normal, at least for my bike. What kind of riding are you doing? Around town sitting at stop lights, or on highways going 60+ mph?
In all my automotive tech years, I have never seen an engine run at temps like you guys are posting and last for very long. Heck, the lead tech at GM for the corvette group sent me this:
Optimal oil temperature is 220 degrees while anything over 250 degrees is dangerous for petroleum-based oils. Synthetic oils can withstand higher temperatures in the 250 to 260 degree range for sustained periods of time.
you can also see the similar info on this site for air cooled Porsche's:
http://www.elephantracing.com/techtopic/oiltemperature.htm (http://www.elephantracing.com/techtopic/oiltemperature.htm)
My question is: where are they measuring the oil temp at on the engine? Perhaps the location is not an oil temp but a "head" temp? I'm not getting a warm/IZ_ feeling about it. Excuse the pun... Oil temp is critical in an air cooled engine vs a water cooled. Though temps like that would eventually kill a water cooled. I personally would be very nervous about operating temps like that. If they are indeed actual oil temps I would do an oil cooler upgrade (inc a temp activated fan) immediately and switch to synth regardless of actual oil temps!!
The temp of the 696 and the original monsters are taken at two differnt locations. You dont really know the oil temp of the 696 (atleast i dont think so). But if the engien is anything like the 695, you can assume the operational temps are the same. Aka 300 is not uncommon on hot summer days. Out on the road, 270-280 is about right. Im not sure what the breaking point of FULLY synthetic oils is, but i cant inmagine it being only 40 degrees higher than that of dino oil. Maybe that number is for semi synthetic?
With an oil cooler, my bike does 240-260. so theres about 20-30degree difference with the oil cooler.
Quote from: He Man on December 26, 2008, 01:11:49 PM
The temp of the 696 and the original monsters are taken at two differnt locations. You dont really know the oil temp of the 696 (atleast i dont think so). But if the engien is anything like the 695, you can assume the operational temps are the same. Aka 300 is uncommon on hot summer days. Out on the road, 270-280 is about right. Im not sure what the breaking point of FULLY synthetic oils is, but i cant inmagine it being only 40 degrees higher than that of dino oil. Maybe that number is for semi synthetic?
With an oil cooler, my bike does 240-260. so theres about 20-30degree difference with the oil cooler.
Yeah, I just can't see that being an actual oil temp. It is flat out just too high to be a working temp. It's gotta be some hybrid thingy or the cyl head temp or....??????
Check that.
"aka 300 is NOT uncommon on hot summer days"
I heard it was a cyclinder head temp too.
Quote from: deadzone on December 26, 2008, 05:01:49 AM
Since i started riding it the oil temp indicator has being climbing, at first when it reached 200 F i thought that something was wrong but then i realized that they where F and not C as the manual stated. Some weeks have passed and today it reached 472 F with 5 bars ( air temp has always being from 95 to 105 ). When it reaches to 5 bars (the day starts with 1) it gives allot of heat on my legs and knees.
Where are you getting the 472 F number? 5 bars is status 6, which means oil temperature between 161 C (322 F) and 175 C (347 F).
My 696 is usually at 2 bars (with outside temperatures not much higher than the 50's since I bought it), it gets to 3 bars after I stand in traffic for a while or I go near the redline, and then it pretty much stays at 3 bars.
Giordy
Quote from: hypurone on December 26, 2008, 01:25:29 PM
Yeah, I just can't see that being an actual oil temp. It is flat out just too high to be a working temp. It's gotta be some hybrid thingy or the cyl head temp or....??????
According to the parts manual, there is a "temperature sensor" (part 552.4.145.2A) in the vertical cylinder and a generic "sensor" (part 552.4.132.1A) in the crankcase half. I'm not sure what the latter does (maybe oil pressure?) but if the former is the one used for the oil temperature, then it's not an actual oil temp.
Giordy
The sensor is in the cylinder, not the crankcase, so i would think it is measuring both hotter oil and cylinder temperature as well. 5 bars, according to the owner's manual is 321 to 347oF*. Do have your dealer inspect your coil wiring though, particularly if the bike likes to surge at 3-4K RPM since running hot and surge are both symptoms of the problem.
Correction by me, Bladecutter's numbers are correct.
Quote from: deadzone on December 26, 2008, 08:56:35 AM
...
You are correct the manual shows >201 C and 7 bars, but it has not gone over 5 bars for me and now it shows 485, every time i ride it goes a little higher.
...
are you looking at the odometer? when it hits 600 degrees take it back for an oil change. [laugh]
Quoteare you looking at the odometer? when it hits 600 degrees take it back for an oil change. laughingdp
Aaron, Thanks for making me start out the day with a laugh. Wonder if you just might be right though?? :)
Quote from: deadzone on December 26, 2008, 05:01:49 AM
This is my first bike and first Ducati. I have a brand new 696 for 2 months now. I have being learning allot from this forum and is really incredible how friendly you'll are when a newbie comes in.
Since i started riding it the oil temp indicator has being climbing, at first when it reached 200 F i thought that something was wrong but then i realized that they where F and not C as the manual stated. Some weeks have passed and today it reached 472 F with 5 bars ( air temp has always being from 95 to 105 ). When it reaches to 5 bars (the day starts with 1) it gives allot of heat on my legs and knees.
Im not sure if this is common but im afraid something is going to happen to the bike.
Just to make this perfectly clear:
1 bar visible = -40 C and +80 C is equal to -40 F and 176 F
2 bars = 81 C to 110 C is equal to 177 F to 230 F
3 bars = 111 C to 135 C is equal to 231 F to 275 F
4 bars = 136 C to 160 C is equal to 276 F to 320 F
5 bars = 161 C to 175 C is equal to 321 F to 347 F
6 bars = 176 C to 190 C is equal to 348 F to 374 F
7 bars = 191 C to 200 C is equal to 375 F to 392 F
All 7 bars flashing means that it is above 201 C which is 393 F.
Please reread pages 23 through 25 in your 696 owners manual again, more clearly.
And just to give you an idea of how high synthetic engine oils can go, temp wise, here's a product data sheet for Mobil 1 0W40 car engine oil:
http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil_1_0W-40.asp (http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil_1_0W-40.asp)
Note that the Flash point for the oil is 230 C, which is 446 F.
That is the point where oil vapor can catch on fire, under just the right circumstances.
And in case you wanted to see the Mobil 1 motorcycle oil pdf, here it is:
http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil1_Motorcycle_Oils.asp (http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil1_Motorcycle_Oils.asp)
Note that the 10W40 goes up to 253 C, which is a stunning 487 F, and the 20W50 goes all the way up to 270 C, which bring the temp up to 518 F.
So, do you still think your engine is too hot now?
BC.
Quote from: aaronb on December 26, 2008, 08:42:41 PM
are you looking at the odometer? when it hits 600 degrees take it back for an oil change. [laugh]
We might have a winner here! When the temperature reaches 1000F, I'd be really concerned. ;)
ok this is a 696 and maybe a newer one. but have you had the coils checked?
they were all supposed to be fixed, but at some point i would expect a few to slip by the dealers if that had them in stock for awhile.
the early bikes have a misfire that happens about 4000-4500 rpm due to the coil wires being swapped from the factory.
mine was one and i did have the overheat issue. i ran 5+ bars on the bad days. even had to stop the bike on a 1hr highway trip due ot the overheating. anyway. i got the coils checked and wires fixed. never seen higher than 4 bars even in hot city stop and go.
I emailed (and talked to) DNA about this exact issue and this is what they said. The temp comes from two sensors. So, the above sensors that another user posted are what I would expect to be the two in question.
I just had the DP oil cooler installed the other week, but since mother nature cant decide if late Dec. is really spring or winter, it will be a while until I get it out on the roads.
QuoteNote that the 10W40 goes up to 253 C, which is a stunning 487 F, and the 20W50 goes all the way up to 270 C, which bring the temp up to 518 F.
So, do you still think your engine is too hot now?
Now, I think we need to clarify something here. Just because your oil may be operating below its flash point and isn't in danger of bursting into flame doesn't mean that it's not too hot to be providing good lubrication. And yes, if his oil temp really is 472F, it's too hot.
Quote from: Langanobob on December 27, 2008, 06:33:25 PM
And yes, if his oil temp really is 472F, it's too hot.
The problem is that his bike was only running 4 or five bars, and he was doing his conversion from C to F incorrectly.
His oil was nowhere near 472 F.
4 and 5 bars is normal, HOT weather riding on the 696.
BC.
Mine did the same thing when it was new. I hit seven bars and it ran real rough till I pulled over and let it cool down. The coil wires were backwards. A handfull of the earlier produced bikes had this. It is an easy fix for your dealer, and should be a recall. Mine runs fine now no over heating anymore.