A lil heads up for those of you who have a 1098
My bike drank a quart of oil in about 500 miles. weeeeeee
No leaks, and no real smoking noticed.
The bike has a lil over 6000 miles on her, and she's never been ridden super aggressively.
I took the bike into Modesto Ducati to see what the problem was, and was told that in a few cases, it has been found that for some reason, the horizontal piston, was placed on the vertical slot, causing abnormal piston ring failure. They tore the bike down, and sure enough, damage to the vertical cylinder.
They are replacing the vertical piston and cylinder (parts should be in today :o )
From what I've been told...... all the ones that have gone bad, happen around the same milage.
weeeeeee.... free 7k service [laugh]
For any of you anywhere close to them.... I highly recommend Modesto Ducati for sales and service. It's a 6 hour round trip for me and I even drive/ride pass a closer dealer, because their service is that good.
my friend here who rarely pops on here anymore (because he is more an interwebz luddite - Mongomakefit from the old board - now MongoReturns I think) had the exact same thing happen with his towards the end of last summer...complete motor teardown and rebuild courtesy of DNA performed expertly by DucPond!
That's some quick turnaround, BP.
But on the downside, I guess Duc quality control (or lack thereof) strikes again. Any long-term issues expected from this?
Quote from: swampduc on January 27, 2009, 01:00:04 PM
That's some quick turnaround, BP.
But on the downside, I guess Duc quality control (or lack thereof) strikes again. Any long-term issues expected from this?
none that I have heard.
but I have been told that as well as the bike ran before...expect a lil better ;D
my only real concern is.... if the "a" piston is in the "b" slot, is the 'b" piston in the "a" spot?, or did it have two of the same...... and will that become an issue later?
Quote from: bobspapa on January 27, 2009, 01:06:11 PM
my only real concern is.... if the "a" piston is in the "b" slot, is the 'b" piston in the "a" spot?, or did it have two of the same...... and will that become an issue later?
Wouldn't that be easy to check while it's being torn down?
Quote from: MikeZ on January 27, 2009, 01:34:38 PM
Wouldn't that be easy to check while it's being torn down?
I assume they did that.... I'll ask when I pick it up.
Couldn't you just ride a wheelie, then the vertical cylinder would be horizontal and vice versa?
That is so curious. Is the horizontal piston a completely different part from the vertical piston?
Quote from: silentbob on January 27, 2009, 02:48:54 PM
Couldn't you just ride a wheelie, then the vertical cylinder would be horizontal and vice versa?
I dont have your skillset [laugh]
Not likely that they took the horizontal cylinder off, unless that's part of the warranty bulletin.
And it *should* run better afterward, as it won't be slurping all of that oil.
Not sure if you're still running the stock exhaust, but all of that oil likely FUBARed the catalytic converter.
Parts catalogue says both pistons are the same, as are the rings.
Quote from: Speeddog on January 27, 2009, 02:56:00 PM
Not likely that they took the horizontal cylinder off, unless that's part of the warranty bulletin.
And it *should* run better afterward, as it won't be slurping all of that oil.
Not sure if you're still running the stock exhaust, but all of that oil likely FUBARed the catalytic converter.
Parts catalogue says both pistons are the same, as are the rings.
exhaust is still stock
Quote from: Speeddog on January 27, 2009, 02:56:00 PM
Not likely that they took the horizontal cylinder off, unless that's part of the warranty bulletin.
And it *should* run better afterward, as it won't be slurping all of that oil.
Not sure if you're still running the stock exhaust, but all of that oil likely FUBARed the catalytic converter.
Parts catalogue says both pistons are the same, as are the rings.
do the air cooled bikes have different pistons, due higher temps at the rear cylinder? that would make sense, kinda, but i would think that the water cooled bike would have pretty consistent temps between the two cylinders
QuoteParts catalogue says both pistons are the same, as are the rings.
The Plot Thickens. Must be more to this story?
Quote from: aaronb on January 27, 2009, 03:48:26 PM
do the air cooled bikes have different pistons, due higher temps at the rear cylinder? that would make sense, kinda, but i would think that the water cooled bike would have pretty consistent temps between the two cylinders
I didn't do an exhaustive search, but AFAIK, the air-cooled bikes use the same pistons between horizontal and vertical.
Quote from: Langanobob on January 27, 2009, 07:13:32 PM
The Plot Thickens. Must be more to this story?
I think so.
The OEM cast iron oil rings are quite easy to break. DAMHIK.
- edit - Don't know if the 1098 uses cast iron oil rings or not - /edit -
Perhaps they had some installation difficulties at the factory resulting in broken/cracked oil rings.
Seems odd that it would take that kind of mileage to rack up to see the issue if that was the case.
Maybe it was just bad oil rings or bad machining of the ring groove.
But that would lead one to think it wouldn't just happen on verticals.
Quote from: bobspapa on January 27, 2009, 12:07:16 PM
For any of you anywhere close to them.... I highly recommend Modesto Ducati for sales and service. It's a 6 hour round trip for me and I even drive/ride pass a closer dealer, because their service is that good.
Glad they worked it out for you. Modesto didn't seem interested in looking at my problem.
QuoteGlad they worked it out for you. Modesto didn't seem interested in looking at my problem.
If your problem has anything to do with that Avatar I can't blame them... [laugh] JK!
Quote from: bobspapa on January 27, 2009, 12:07:16 PM
A lil heads up for those of you who have a 1098
My bike drank a quart of oil in about 500 miles. weeeeeee
No leaks, and no real smoking noticed.
The bike has a lil over 6000 miles on her, and she's never been ridden super aggressively.
I took the bike into Modesto Ducati to see what the problem was, and was told that in a few cases, it has been found that for some reason, the horizontal piston, was placed on the vertical slot, causing abnormal piston ring failure. They tore the bike down, and sure enough, damage to the vertical cylinder.
They are replacing the vertical piston and cylinder (parts should be in today :o )
From what I've been told...... all the ones that have gone bad, happen around the same milage.
weeeeeee.... free 7k service [laugh]
For any of you anywhere close to them.... I highly recommend Modesto Ducati for sales and service. It's a 6 hour round trip for me and I even drive/ride pass a closer dealer, because their service is that good.
b/p, that's odd ! My 1098R has over 3000 miles on the clock and so far it has only sipped oil . I broke the bike in by the manual but after the 1st 1500 miles it has been ridden Fassssssssst. Maybe not hard ...but Fassssssssssst. In the second 1500 miles the oil level has barely dropped.
Thanks for the heads up. Dolph :)
Quote from: silentbob on January 27, 2009, 02:48:54 PM
Couldn't you just ride a wheelie, then the vertical cylinder would be horizontal and vice versa?
I like the way you think Rob Dolph :)
Quote from: bobspapa on January 27, 2009, 12:07:16 PM
A lil heads up for those of you who have a 1098
My bike drank a quart of oil in about 500 miles. weeeeeee
No leaks, and no real smoking noticed.
The bike has a lil over 6000 miles on her, and she's never been ridden super aggressively.
I took the bike into Modesto Ducati to see what the problem was, and was told that in a few cases, it has been found that for some reason, the horizontal piston, was placed on the vertical slot, causing abnormal piston ring failure. They tore the bike down, and sure enough, damage to the vertical cylinder.
They are replacing the vertical piston and cylinder (parts should be in today :o )
From what I've been told...... all the ones that have gone bad, happen around the same milage.
weeeeeee.... free 7k service [laugh]
For any of you anywhere close to them.... I highly recommend Modesto Ducati for sales and service. It's a 6 hour round trip for me and I even drive/ride pass a closer dealer, because their service is that good.
Just thought of something.......in a 6 hour round trip I could be in 5 different states ....not in the same 6 hour trip. I might have to average 70 mph. Dolph :)
Quote from: flynbulldog on January 27, 2009, 09:42:53 PM
If your problem has anything to do with that Avatar I can't blame them... [laugh] JK!
What? I have a chemical imbalance, you insensitive clod. ;)
It looks a litle worse than just chemical ;)
The pistons and rings are the same in both cylinders. That bit about the horizontal piston being in the vertical cylinder is a load of cheese. Your oil usage is, however, likely to be corrected by changing cylinders, pistons, and rings, but only if you break it in properly. Believe it or not, these bikes do not need to be incredibly babied when broken in, and in fact being too easy on them can prevent the rings from seating properly and result in excessive blowby, which will show up in a leakdown test. These bikes come with full synthetic oil which does an incredible job of protecting the engine from hurting itself. On the downside, the synthetic oil can also prevent the rings from scuffing the cylinders and creating a proper seal. The answer, other than using old-fashioned dinosaur oil, is to break them in a bit harder than you think is right. The manufacturers can't recommend this as it's precisely when most riders are getting used to a new motorcycle that they're most likely to crash. To urge a new rider on an unfamiliar bike to go out and thrash it would open them up to insane lawsuits. But if you want your bike to break in on the full synthetic oil, you've got to ride it harder than you think. You won't hurt it. And yes, this goes for all you Duc owners out there, 2v or 4v, air cooled or liquid cooled. You don't need to wring its neck, but you do need to run it through its rev range and ride it hard. Don't putt-putt around and baby it when it's new and you'll be rewarded with a much better running motorcycle in the long run.
Quote from: mxwinky on February 02, 2009, 09:47:44 AM
The pistons and rings are the same in both cylinders. That bit about the horizontal piston being in the vertical cylinder is a load of cheese. Your oil usage is, however, likely to be corrected by changing cylinders, pistons, and rings, but only if you break it in properly. Believe it or not, these bikes do not need to be incredibly babied when broken in, and in fact being too easy on them can prevent the rings from seating properly and result in excessive blowby, which will show up in a leakdown test. These bikes come with full synthetic oil which does an incredible job of protecting the engine from hurting itself. On the downside, the synthetic oil can also prevent the rings from scuffing the cylinders and creating a proper seal. The answer, other than using old-fashioned dinosaur oil, is to break them in a bit harder than you think is right. The manufacturers can't recommend this as it's precisely when most riders are getting used to a new motorcycle that they're most likely to crash. To urge a new rider on an unfamiliar bike to go out and thrash it would open them up to insane lawsuits. But if you want your bike to break in on the full synthetic oil, you've got to ride it harder than you think. You won't hurt it. And yes, this goes for all you Duc owners out there, 2v or 4v, air cooled or liquid cooled. You don't need to wring its neck, but you do need to run it through its rev range and ride it hard. Don't putt-putt around and baby it when it's new and you'll be rewarded with a much better running motorcycle in the long run.
Same holds true for most everything running full synthetic.
saw the old parts today.
the lower ring on the vertical cyl failed. it looked bent down.
whenever the rain ceases..... she'll get tested ;D
The lower ring is the oil control ring. That thing should run good now.
09 696 here and looks like small, slow, but evident oil leak AND nearly quart low at approx 1500 miles, well after the 600 mile service. Anyone to chime in on this btw also?
Quote from: NekkedChic on February 10, 2009, 02:19:30 PM
09 696 here and looks like small, slow, but evident oil leak AND nearly quart low at approx 1500 miles, well after the 600 mile service. Anyone to chime in on this btw also?
take it in and have them do a compression test.
look for any and all possible exernal leaks
also, document any time you have to add oil, and note milage. keep reciepts if you purchased oil (check when on a leval surface and while warm)
Quote from: bobspapa on February 10, 2009, 02:29:20 PM
take it in and have them do a compression test.
look for any and all possible exernal leaks
also, document any time you have to add oil, and note milage. keep reciepts if you purchased oil (check when on a leval surface and while warm)
[thumbsup] TKS! Yuppers, DEF need to get the boy in for a good check, the miles keep flyin by before I realize it. Good news is not had to add a drop since that one time and think it has been a good 500 miles since that. Still, I SMELL the oil burning where it has leaked onto when bike gets hot, riding, AND can see it clearly, but just difficult to tell exactly where it comes from initially. It IS clean, fresh appearing.
will call and make appointment for it in morning tho... curious if anyone else is seeing same also tho.
Quote from: NekkedChic on February 10, 2009, 02:19:30 PM
09 696 here and looks like small, slow, but evident oil leak AND nearly quart low at approx 1500 miles, well after the 600 mile service. Anyone to chime in on this btw also?
Had a similar problem with my 696, though I didn't lose a quart. Turned out the filter wasn't tight enough. The shop had tightened it to Duc specs at the 600 service (at least they said they did), but when tightened some more, the leak stopped. Not uncommon with Ducs from what I hear.
Quote from: swampduc on February 10, 2009, 04:12:36 PM
Had a similar problem with my 696, though I didn't lose a quart. Turned out the filter wasn't tight enough. The shop had tightened it to Duc specs at the 600 service (at least they said they did), but when tightened some more, the leak stopped. Not uncommon with Ducs from what I hear.
Tk You Sir! Comforting, but calling Mellilimoto in am to get appointment and have it checked ASAP. Sumthin def not right to lose that much AND visible oil drips etc. Still under warranty so now is time to get it taken care of also.