Some unbelievable riding... poetry through the corners.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZK3NBehx4d0
Quote from: roy-nexus-6 on May 16, 2008, 05:15:14 AM
Some unbelievable riding.
Troy Bayliss is a great rider and has done wonderful things in World Superbike racing, plus that last MotoGP race he rode in, but "unbelievable"?
I regularly watch the MotoGP races, the World Superbike races, and the occasional AMA Superbike race, and I didn't see anything unbelievable about his qualifying run. It looks pretty much like any other racer, but a little bit faster.
Those Italian announcers sounded pretty excited about it,though.
Quote from: ScottRNelson on May 16, 2008, 08:01:30 AM
I regularly watch the MotoGP races, the World Superbike races, and the occasional AMA Superbike race, and I didn't see anything unbelievable about his qualifying run. It looks pretty much like any other racer, but a little bit faster.
lol - I was thinking more in terms of comparing Baliss to me, and not to the other riders! ;D His skill set is so far beyond me that I find myself shaking my head in awe.
Same deal Rossi.
Same deal Stoner.
etc etc.
why does he always stick his left foot out just before turning in?
I notice several riders doing this...rossi, pedrosa, stoner, and others. Troy definitely does it more often. During one inside pass at Monza he damn near drug his foot for 3-4 sec motard style. It seems to happen more frequently when the rider is really pushing into a left hand turn coming off a high speed section. I think it is for stability during heavy braking before turn in. Moving the left leg off the bike moves the center of gravity more towards the inside, so the rear end can't step to the inside/left, forcing the rear to the outside, and keeping the bike in line for the upcoming turn. I have seen several racers forced to alter their line and run off b/c the rear end was skipping around during breaking and they were not allowed to turn in at the point they intended.
Like I said, it seems to happen most often when they are really cooking into an upcoming turn and braking more than normal making the rider a little uncomfortable, so they "throw the anchor out"!
Quote from: BastrdHK on May 17, 2008, 10:08:35 AM
I notice several riders doing this...rossi, pedrosa, stoner, and others. Troy definitely does it more often. During one inside pass at Monza he damn near drug his foot for 3-4 sec motard style. It seems to happen more frequently when the rider is really pushing into a left hand turn coming off a high speed section. I think it is for stability during heavy braking before turn in. Moving the left leg off the bike moves the center of gravity more towards the inside, so the rear end can't step to the inside/left, forcing the rear to the outside, and keeping the bike in line for the upcoming turn. I have seen several racers forced to alter their line and run off b/c the rear end was skipping around during breaking and they were not allowed to turn in at the point they intended.
Like I said, it seems to happen most often when they are really cooking into an upcoming turn and braking more than normal making the rider a little uncomfortable, so they "throw the anchor out"!
Ok, that is about a billion times more informed than my best guess.
I thought he was cocking the left foot out because he needs his knee to bend over the bike while he leaning down into the right hand corners. If the foot/knee were pointing forward, he wouldn't be able to get as low as he does. :-[ <- n00b
(http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm47/roy-nexus-6/bayliss.jpg)
Quote from: roy-nexus-6 on May 17, 2008, 07:17:34 PM
Ok, that is about a billion times more informed than my best guess.
I thought he was cocking the left foot out because he needs his knee to bend over the bike while he leaning down into the right hand corners. If the foot/knee were pointing forward, he wouldn't be able to get as low as he does. :-[ <- n00b
(http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm47/roy-nexus-6/bayliss.jpg)
thats not what i was referring to, watch the video again, he does a little foot move at ~:50 and a big one ~1:25. he actually take his left foot off of the peg just before turn in.
HK's explanation makes sense to me.
Quote from: aaronb on May 18, 2008, 08:10:24 AM
thats not what i was referring to, watch the video again, he does a little foot move at ~:50 and a big one ~1:25. he actually take his left foot off of the peg just before turn in.
HK's explanation makes sense to me.
Re-watched - I'm with you now! [beer]
Quote from: roy-nexus-6 on May 17, 2008, 07:17:34 PM
Ok, that is about a billion times more informed than my best guess.
I thought he was cocking the left foot out because he needs his knee to bend over the bike while he leaning down into the right hand corners. If the foot/knee were pointing forward, he wouldn't be able to get as low as he does. :-[ <- n00b
(http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm47/roy-nexus-6/bayliss.jpg)
Roy, thanks for pointing this out.....we are always taught to ride with our weight on the balls of our feet...it looks like they are putting the peg in the arch of the boot. That would allow you to push forward and right, while allowing a quick shift on exit.....thoughts? I haven't read any advanced riding techniques, so lets hear it!
Quote from: aaronb on May 16, 2008, 06:46:43 PM
why does he always stick his left foot out just before turning in?
thats because hes australian and over here we have shit loads of kangaroos ,rabbits ,and other wildlife that likes getting on the road so arfter a long career of riding on the road it just comes natural to get ready to kick them outer the road you watch all the ozzies they all do it
Quote from: aaronb on May 16, 2008, 06:46:43 PM
why does he always stick his left foot out just before turning in?
The reason Bayliss and pretty much every rider takes their left foot off the peg entering a corner is they have finished down-shifting and are positioning their foot to up-shift powering through and/or out of the corner.
Also, race bikes use what is commonly known as GP-shifting. First gear is on the top and sixth gear (or whatever the top gear is) is on the bottom. The reason for this is that if the rider's foot was under the shift lever preparing to up-shift, their toe would drag on the ground. This allows the rider to up-shift while leaning over. In other words, it would limit how far the bike could lean over.
Quote from: Gypsy Davy on May 28, 2008, 09:55:30 PM
The reason Bayliss and pretty much every rider takes their left foot off the peg entering a corner is they have finished down-shifting and are positioning their foot to up-shift powering through and/or out of the corner.
Watch the video again! 8)
Quote from: BastrdHK on May 31, 2008, 08:41:52 AM
Watch the video again! 8)
What's your point? Did I not explain the process clearly enough?
Bayliss down-shifts as he approaches the turn. The shit lever is on top of the toe of his boot. He moves his foot to the side and places the toe of his boot on top of the shift lever. This way he is ready to up-shift while accelerating out of the turn.
If your theory about shifting the rider's weight to the inside of the bike is true, why does Bayliss kick out his left foot entering Ascari, the only left turn at Monza?
last time i checked you do not have to completely remove your foot from the peg to move the top side of the shifter.
Quote from: aaronb on June 01, 2008, 10:57:00 AM
last time i checked you do not have to completely remove your foot from the peg to move the top side of the shifter.
in cramped quarters (read: with high footpeg position), it's easier to take your foot off the peg entirely to reposition it after shifting.
notice that they don't do the same w/ their right foot in right-hand turns.
Quote from: ScottRNelson on May 16, 2008, 08:01:30 AM
Troy Bayliss is a great rider and has done wonderful things in World Superbike racing, plus that last MotoGP race he rode in, but "unbelievable"?
I regularly watch the MotoGP races, the World Superbike races, and the occasional AMA Superbike race, and I didn't see anything unbelievable about his qualifying run. It looks pretty much like any other racer, but a little bit faster.
Those Italian announcers sounded pretty excited about it,though.
iirc, he was on provisional pole and, as such, the last racer to go out in superpole. they were excited as he went green in each sector to take pole position for the race.
Quote from: Gypsy Davy on May 31, 2008, 09:13:53 PM
What's your point? Did I not explain the process clearly enough?
I apologize for not making my previous statement crystal. WATCH THE VIDEO AGAIN! READ THE ENTIRE POST...AGAIN!
Quote from: Gypsy Davy on May 31, 2008, 09:13:53 PM
If your theory about shifting the rider's weight to the inside of the bike is true, why does Bayliss kick out his left foot entering Ascari, the only left turn at Monza?
The OP does concern left turns, seconda variante SPECIFICALLY. The second chicane, one of the other lefts you forgot about. Several racers when entering left handers too hot will throw their left leg out to shift weight to the inside in preparation for a turn in at a speed they are not comfortable with. Here is a pic of Bayliss overtaking in the second race. 8)
(http://img37.picoodle.com/img/img37/4/6/8/f_vlcsnap4590m_652999d.png)
I don't refute the statement about removing the left foot from the peg after down shifts in preparation for an up shift as Derby suggested. I ride the GP pattern and don't find it necessary, but I am not racing WSBK on a 1098 F08 either. I think you were trying to answer my question as to why Bayliss(and others) point their outside foot out while positioning the peg in the arch of their boot verses the ball of the foot. 8)
Anyone? [popcorn]
Quote from: BastrdHK on June 08, 2008, 07:29:43 PM
I think you were trying to answer my question as to why Bayliss(and others) point their outside foot out while positioning the peg in the arch of their boot verses the ball of the foot. 8)
Anyone? [popcorn]
better position to properly weight the outside peg.
makes sense considering the forces acting on the body would require a more secure "foothold" at those speeds.....thanks derby!
Did they have 3 announcers talking simultaneously, or just 2? [roll]
Quote from: BastrdHK on June 08, 2008, 07:29:43 PM
I apologize for not making my previous statement crystal. WATCH THE VIDEO AGAIN! READ THE ENTIRE POST...AGAIN!
The OP does concern left turns, seconda variante SPECIFICALLY. The second chicane, one of the other lefts you forgot about. Several racers when entering left handers too hot will throw their left leg out to shift weight to the inside in preparation for a turn in at a speed they are not comfortable with. Here is a pic of Bayliss overtaking in the second race. 8)
I don't refute the statement about removing the left foot from the peg after down shifts in preparation for an up shift as Derby suggested. I ride the GP pattern and don't find it necessary, but I am not racing WSBK on a 1098 F08 either. I think you were trying to answer my question as to why Bayliss(and others) point their outside foot out while positioning the peg in the arch of their boot verses the ball of the foot. 8)
Anyone? [popcorn]
I apologize if English s not your first language but it’s difficult to maintain an intelligent discussion with someone who has such a poor grasp of the language.
First-off, you should get your facts straight. I was not answering the OP (or you) but he following:
Quote from: aaronb on May 16, 2008, 06:46:43 PM
why does he always stick his left foot out just before turning in?
I explained what Bayliss was doing and why. I base this on my experience of riding for about forty-five years and racing for seven of those years. You response was:
Quote from: BastrdHK on May 31, 2008, 08:41:52 AM
Watch the video again! 8)
Since I had not addressed you, I assumed you either didn’t understand what I said or you disagreed. Either way, I explained once more what Bayliss was doing, and also the flaw in your theory that it had something to do with weight transfer. (If it did, Bayliss would be kicking his left foot out to turn one way and his right foot out to turn the other.)
Lifting the left foot off the footpeg does not in-and-of-itself shift body weight to the left. The only way body weight is shifted to the left effectively is by leaving the left foot on the peg. This effectively lowers the center of mass to the left peg, as is desired. The physics make no sense otherwise.
Bayliss shifts his weight to the inside footpeg when he shifts his butt halfway off the side of the seat. He shifts his weight left to turn left and right to turn right. The movement of his left foot is completely independent of this.
Watch the video again and look where Bayliss shifts his entire body to the inside, just before turn-in. That’s the point were he is shifting his weight to he inside of the bike.
Seriously??
You don't need physics......just common sense. The pros do not move their right foot in the same manner when aggressively entering a right hander(left hander or any braking zone for that matter), why???......rear brake is being applied!!! [bang]
Quote from: BastrdHK on June 09, 2008, 09:18:43 PM
Seriously??
You don't need physics......just common sense. The pros do not move their right foot in the same manner when aggressively entering a right hander(left hander or any braking zone for that matter), why???......rear brake is being applied!!! [bang]
many racers never touch the rear brake...
the difference in the foot movement is due to
what they're doing prior to what you're seeing.
with a gp-shift pattern and jockey-high footpeg position, you can slide your foot forward for upshifts but it's easier to pull your foot off the peg entirely to reposition it from under the shifter (downshifting) to the ball of your foot.
your foot is never under the brake lever, so you simply have to slide the ball of your foot back onto the peg.
if you watch racers that don't use a gp-shift pattern (like mat mladin), you'll likely see something similar, but on the exit of a turn instead..
Quote from: BastrdHK on June 09, 2008, 09:18:43 PM
Seriously??
You don't need physics......just common sense. The pros do not move their right foot in the same manner when aggressively entering a right hander(left hander or any braking zone for that matter), why???......rear brake is being applied!!! [bang]
It’s obvious you either didn’t understand a word I wrote or you’re trolling for an argument. Either way I’m done with you.
I'm sorry, Bayliss is not simply moving his foot out from under the shifter in the picture above. It is right there....in COLOR! I am not saying this occurs every corner, but when overtaking or entering the corner hot such as in qualifying.
Derby, I know you have recognized this tendency in GP. Rossi will hesitate as he "repositions" his left foot on the peg after downshifting, but only in when entering left handers at a speed that is uncomfortable for him.