I didn't do much highway time on my 696 until recently since I picked it up last winter. I currently have a Scorpion EXO-1000. I find that the wind noise is way worse with the naked monster than it was on my SV with fairings at highway speed. I am thinking about buying a new helmet (had a minor spill), and so I want to consider my options. I would also prefer something that has an inner tinted visor. I'm willing to spend up to somewhere in the $400 range. Any suggestions would be much appreciated. Thanks!
Do you have the mini-fairing on? When I had my 696 I left the mini-fairing on. I am 5'8 and the fairing pushed all the wind on me at my helmet. I felt like I was getting whipped around and it was noisier. When I got the 1100, I left the fairing off and all the wind hits me at chest level making my ride more comfortable and probably a little less noisy.
Regardless of what helmet you buy, earplugs work great for wind noise too, not just exhaust music. I was surprised to find out that my hearing actually improved last year (annual physical checks hearing, high frequency hearing loss over the last 8 years or so) since I have been wearing my earplugs frequently. Seems to make me more focused also as I can hear myself think (not always the best thing though) [evil]
the more money you spend, the quiter the helmet gets. Personally the most quiet helmet i own was the Shoei RF-1000. The loudest i own is the EXO-700. My Shark RSR2 is pretty loud, but no where near the EXO.
Your not going to find a lot of options with built in visor.
also i wear earplugs, so it really kills the wind noise for me. And if you ride with your visor up, yea its going to be pretty loud. You can also try a neck gaiter that keeps wind from swooshing around under your helmet, but i like the breeze.
Wind noise from the EXO 1000 is high. Earplugs work, and you should always wear them anyway.
Quote from: He Man on April 28, 2010, 09:22:31 PM
also i wear earplugs, so it really kills the wind noise for me.
Quote from: howie on April 29, 2010, 01:43:35 AM
Earplugs work, and you should always wear them anyway.
On the track, sure....Are there not safety concerns with plugs on the street? Can "termis" by example be that loud that one can sustain hearing damage?
Anything over 85 db can cause hearing damage.
I find ear plugs actually help me hear some sounds on the street from other vehicles plus reduce fatigue. Wind noise blocks a lot of other sounds. If you ride without earplugs at speed for extended periods of time you will suffer permanent hearing loss accompanied by tinnitus (ringing in the ears).
I've always thought about wearing ear plugs, but I live in the city, and as others have mentioned, I am worried about hearing what's going on around me. There is a lot of crazy traffic in the city to be aware of and it helps to be able to hear it. I guess I could just pick some cheap ones up, and try it out.
I kind of figured that the more you spend, the quiter it gets. I was just looking to get recommendations on a particular helmet that others have tested (and if it particularly comes with an inner visor).
I guess I could try removing the bikini fairing and see if that makes a difference. I know a lot of people remove it, but I kind of like the way mine looks.
Thanks so far. Keep the recommendations coming!
Ok maybe I'm weird, but what sounds are you afraid of losing when riding in town? I find that its easier to hear with ear plugs in. Sure everything is quieter, but its never silent. Most of the lost sound is things like wind noise and "street noise" but you'd have no problem hearing a horn or something. But then again I don't live in a place with much traffic (and I avoid it if I'm on my bike), so maybe I'm not a great example. On the highway everyone should wear earplugs, but if you want to listen to music, try the JVC Marshmallows.
Less fatigue from wearing earplugs on a trip is always a good thing [thumbsup]
Ear plugs are a must.
You won't realize it until you've worn them enough to get comfortable.
The cheap foam ones are sufficient, give them a couple days if you're not expert at installing.
(good link - clip from EARS on the ear plugs thread about how to put them in).
Use quiet as the last criteria for a helmet.
Ear plugs + whatever. Yeah, I'll ditch them on short runs around town, if it's just going to be a quick A to B, but generally They are all in.
I'm guessing by 696DCRider that you live near me. And I can tell you for sure, after years of riding in the DC area that ear plugs really don't hamper your awareness. I still can pickup on a siren faster on my bike than my car. Between the sound deadening of the car and the radio you loose a lot more. Also I find that ear plugs cut out some of the mechanical noises from the bike and let me focus more on 'world' noises.
But for helmets - I'm looking for one with an integrated visor as well. There's not a huge selection, but it's growing. One that should appear soon that's right in your price range is the 2010 revamp for AGVs Stealth - the Stealth SV. WebBikeWorld have a very good rating to the AG K3
http://www.webbikeworld.com/r2/motorcycle-helmet/agv-k3/ (http://www.webbikeworld.com/r2/motorcycle-helmet/agv-k3/)
Recently, which is a step down the range from the Stealth - so I'd expect good things from the Stealth SV when it arrives in the US shortly
Go check out webBikeWorlds reviews. All are in depth an they always make note of noise levels.
I'm a musician and though I hate these when playing music, they work really well for protecting against my shortened race cans but I can still hear sirens, car horns, etc...
They're a little over $10 at most music stores.
(http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbase/pics/products/0/4/1/699041.jpg)
Without earplugs anything over 55-60mph is causing you hearing loss. Since it is white noise you don't usually notice how loud the wind is until you take your helmet off and are half deaf for a while.
Horns, tire squealing, etc are not affected by ear plugs that much. I can still hear them fine. I just use the disposable jobsite plugs. If you find the plugs are stopping too much noise there are a variety of plugs available that block more or less decibels.
I think the stat was, for anything 85dbs, you have to have constant source for 3hrs before permanent damage occurs. Now your exahust might not be that loud, but the wind noise is.
Also realize that your ear only hears what ever is louder. Usually wind noise is hte loudest thing since the cause of your sound is usually inside your helmet. So you hear it over everything. Sirens, honks, even a person screaming at you.
Now Earplugs reduce sound by 35dB if used correctly. But you can easily get 25dbs out of them using it improperly. Regardless of what type of plug you pick, musical or standard foamy ( i perfer the later because they are cheap, easy to replace, and you can throw some in your breast pocket incase you loose/drop them etc).
BTW: Im a daily commuter in NYC. I hear everything around me with earplugs in, including the pregnant dog on the phone thats next to me >:(. In fact i couldnt hear without them cause my exahust would dumb down all the noise after 10mins of riding and my ear would be ringing.
Pick a helmet that fits first. Quietness can be attained with earplugs. The combination of fit and noise reduction will make for a great ride experience. If you pick a helmet that doesn't fit your head (no matter how much $$$), I don't care how quiet it is, you're gonna be hating it.
Outside of that... Schuberths seem to get good reviews for quiet. Shoei as well. Arai, not so much (wind noise from the sidepods).
I ride in an Arai Quantum II, and yeah, it has wind noise issues... but it fits my head perfectly, with a set of standard foam earplugs I can hear traffic just fine, and I'm comfortable with the overall noise level. I can ride all day, be completely comfortable, and still hear people talking at normal levels afterward.
The one thing I don't like is that I have a hard time hearing detailed mechanical noises. I like to hear every last thing that's happening in the engine, gearbox, chain, wheel bearings, brakes... at low speed, earplugs diminish these sounds. At high speed, wind noise kills them. C'est la Vie.
Anyway.... I recommend wearing earplugs. The editors at webbikeworld do, too.
Quote from: He Man on April 29, 2010, 10:10:58 AM
I think the stat was, for anything 85dbs, you have to have constant source for 3hrs before permanent damage occurs. Now your exahust might not be that loud, but the wind noise is.
Adding to that... the further north of 85 dB you go, the less exposure time it takes for damage to set in. Also remember that dB is a logarithmic scale, so it doesn't take many more dB to see a significant increase in the amount of damage done.
Quote from: duc_fan on April 29, 2010, 11:12:30 AM
. Also remember that dB is a logarithmic scale, so it doesn't take many more dB to see a significant increase in the amount of damage done.
thats a very good point. When you get into the upper values, every increase of dB is like 10x the power.
I would recommend wearing plugs. Check out the thread on it for lots of reasons why you should.
Fit and comfort are the first rule. Do you have Cycle Gear stores in your area? They have a 7 day return policy, so my advice would be to start trying out helmets and see what fits you and what you are willing to deal with in terms of noise.
Good luck!
Unfortunately, I don't have a cycle gear in my area. I think after hearing everyone's rec's, I'm going to pick up a cheap pair of earplugs and try them out with my current helmet. I'm confident from what others say, that it will be okay in the city. That's easy to try also since it is cheap. I may also pick up a pair of the in-ear iphone earphones to try as well, which is a little more expensive ($80 I think). I do occasionally listen to music while riding, so that may come in handy.
I guess what I've gathered though is that the quietness of the helmet is not all that important since you can supplement with plugs. Like someone mentioned, fit is the most important. Honestly, I like my scorpion exo1000. It is definitely heavier than other helmets, but I haven't really noticed any issues with weight. I don't believe it's ever bothered me. On the other-hand though, I haven't owned any other brand as of yet.
[thumbsup]
Quote from: He Man on April 29, 2010, 11:41:00 AM
thats a very good point. When you get into the upper values, every increase of dB is like 10x the power.
3dB is a doubling of power. An increase of 10dB is 10x the power.
As displayed in the Fletcher Munson curves the ear is sensitive to certain frequency ranges and it takes less power for those frequencies to be perceived as loudly as others, and likewise more power for other frequencies. That might pertain more to the varying levels of sensitivity, but power increases don't change. Perception does, but the real issue with hearing loss is SPL levels, and humans are more affected by the midrange frequencies than anything (ie: the sweet sound of a desmodromic engine and wind at high speeds).
I wear earplugs at all time, or else I'd be out of a job pretty quickly.
I found that my new AGV Stealth is a lot quieter than my Shoei RF1000. I think the wind is just being directed differently as it provides ventilation.
I appreciate how everyone's been capitalizing the B in dB; for 1000 karma points can anyone tell me why it should be capitalized?
"A decibel is one tenth of a bel, a seldom-used unit."
Wikipedia FTW!
Quote from: NoisyDante on April 30, 2010, 07:22:10 AM
3dB is a doubling of power. An increase of 10dB is 10x the power.
As displayed in the Fletcher Munson curves the ear is sensitive to certain frequency ranges and it takes less power for those frequencies to be perceived as loudly as others, and likewise more power for other frequencies. That might pertain more to the varying levels of sensitivity, but power increases don't change. Perception does, but the real issue with hearing loss is SPL levels, and humans are more affected by the midrange frequencies than anything (ie: the sweet sound of a desmodromic engine and wind at high speeds).
I wear earplugs at all time, or else I'd be out of a job pretty quickly.
I found that my new AGV Stealth is a lot quieter than my Shoei RF1000. I think the wind is just being directed differently as it provides ventilation.
I appreciate how everyone's been capitalizing the B in dB; for 1000 karma points can anyone tell me why it should be capitalized?
Quote from: 696DCRider on April 30, 2010, 07:43:46 AM
"A decibel is one tenth of a bel, a seldom-used unit."
Wikipedia FTW!
Well it's a fun fact but you don't win the capitalization prize ;D
I fail :'( I was hoping I could win a pair of those earplugs I need to buy ;D
Quote from: NoisyDante on April 30, 2010, 07:58:57 AM
Well it's a fun fact but you don't win the capitalization prize ;D
Okay, I take that back. Where's my prize?:
"The B in dB stands for the Bel, a unit of measure named after Alexander Graham Bell, inventor of the telephone. Since Bell is a name, the unit named after him always begins with a capital letter - Bel. The decibel is 1/10 of a Bel, so the B in decibel is capitalized in the abbreviation dB."
Reference:
http://radarproblems.com/chapters/ch06.dir/ch06.htm (http://radarproblems.com/chapters/ch06.dir/ch06.htm)
Bingo, it is capitalized because it represents a proper noun, Bell.
You win good karma! [moto] And the opportunity to impress your friends with a fun fact for the day.
I wear the cheap squishy orange foam ones, because honestly they work the best and they're the most comfortable. I've had many pairs made to form to my ears, ones with ball bearings inside, none of them really work as well.
I've tried more than a few types, and these have worked the best (I can hear my bike exhaust with these, which I really want to be able to do, and they are comfortable - I wear them at night to sleep):
http://www.amazon.com/Quiet-Time-Comfort-Foam-Plugs/dp/B001FPCUHA (http://www.amazon.com/Quiet-Time-Comfort-Foam-Plugs/dp/B001FPCUHA)
Walgreens sells them, too.
Decibel Exposure Time Guidelines
Accepted standards for recommended permissible exposure time for continuous time weighted average noise, according to NIOSH and CDC, 2002. For every 3 dBs over 85dB, the permissible exposure time before possible damage can occur is cut in half.
Continuous dB
Permissible Exposure Time
85 db 8 hours
88 dB 4 hours
91 db 2 hours
94 db 1 hour
97 db 30 minutes
100 db 15 minutes
103 db 7.5 minutes
106 dB 3.75 min (< 4min)
109 dB 1.875 min (< 2min)
112 dB .9375 min (~1 min)
115 dB .46875 min (~30 sec)
A helmet that reduces wind noise will also reduce all other noise which includes other cars around you. It would be similar to wearing earplugs. Why not just invest $10 in 50 pairs of disposable ear plugs (which should last you a long while) and buy what ever helmet you want?
Quote from: R0CKETMAN on April 29, 2010, 02:41:09 AM
On the track, sure....Are there not safety concerns with plugs on the street? Can "termis" by example be that loud that one can sustain hearing damage?
Not only can Termis quite easily cause hearing damage, but simple wind noise can. It's well within the frequency range of normal conversation, so damage in that frequency range causes real problems.
Quote from: Povidius on May 08, 2010, 08:53:02 PM
A helmet that reduces wind noise will also reduce all other noise which includes other cars around you. It would be similar to wearing earplugs. Why not just invest $10 in 50 pairs of disposable ear plugs (which should last you a long while) and buy what ever helmet you want?
I am with the second part, but not the first part. I think the conventional wisdom is that stuff sticking off the helmet or anything that contributes to wind turbulence will produce more wind noise. That is the idea is not better sound insulation, but less in the way of sound production.
Quote from: He Man on April 28, 2010, 09:22:31 PM
the more money you spend, the quiter the helmet gets.
I would hope that someone designing an expensive helmet would put some thought into noise reduction. But I am not sure that more expensive always equals quieter.
I will add my vote to the pro-earplug faction. Buy a helmet that best fits your head and safety requirements ...
Yes the safest helmet is one that fits properly. And a proper fit is one you're more likely to wear. Which is always a good idea!
Quote from: mstevens on May 09, 2010, 06:49:09 AM
Not only can Termis quite easily cause hearing damage, but simple wind noise can. It's well within the frequency range of normal conversation, so damage in that frequency range causes real problems.
Yep, got a couple hundred in with plugs. Can't believe I rode without them after I got the Termi's. I wouldn't ride without them now. Hope my hearings not too screwed from the few hundred I did put in.
Quote from: il d00d on May 10, 2010, 01:33:54 PM
But I am not sure that more expensive always equals quieter.
I was always under the impression that part of the additional money one spent went into lighter weight and better venting. IMO, more venting tends to lead to more noise.
If nothing else, my $400 Arai is considerably more noisy than my $80 HJC.
Yeah... more money is not always quieter. My $400+ Arai Quantum II ain't exactly a bubble of tranquility... :-\
But, it's seriously comfortable. [thumbsup]
So... I wear a helmet that fits and is supremely comfortable, and spent a couple dollars on a bulk pack of foam earplugs. Works well. [moto]
If you enjoy listening to music as well, check out the company Earfuze.com custom moldable earphones that isolate noise and fits well under the helmet.
When quiet is important:
http://www.schuberth.com/en/products/motorcycle/s1-pro.html (http://www.schuberth.com/en/products/motorcycle/s1-pro.html)
I`ve had the Schuberth S1 Pro helmet for one month now and it`s the best helmet I have ever tried.
Quiet, excellent ventilation, absolutely no fog, sun visor, comfy...
Still, when I ride without the db-killers in the Arrow pipes I always use plugs.
I have a Schuberth S1 (not the pro) and it is quiet, but it fogs up, so I had to get a Foggy insert for colder weather.
i was recently talking about this with somebody else. I also have an Arai Quantum ii and was commenting on how loud they were. Figured it was the sidepods making it louder... grrr... oh well
I have since started using ear plugs, Flents Quiet! please brand http://www.slate.com/id/2118800 (http://www.slate.com/id/2118800) I actually bought these for shooting because they were the only ones that actually fit and stayed in my ear if touched by the gun stock. they work great for riding as well, as i can put them in and the helmet hitting them on the way over doesn't knock them out. i paid 8 dollars for 30 pairs at CVS.
too bad i already have tinnitus from my years of clubbing in manhattan :P