My boss is out at the Mayo Clinic for surgery to remove his prostate.
He has had some major health related things happen to him in the past and as a result of that gets a full on physical every year.
Last year, ok.
This year, trouble.
In the course of a year (probably longer, it may not have been detectable last year) he went from "fine" to "we need to fix this" :o
My last email from him indicated that the cancer has not spread anywhere else, which is good.
I generally don't know how doctors fix things until I, or someone close to me, needs something fixed.
He opted for the full on, open him up like a heart replacment type of surgery where they'll cut out the entire prostate.
This likely will leave him non functional, sexually. He's pretty well married to his job, and with poor luck finding a lady that he can stand pretty much just lives his life and does whatever he likes. He's a pretty happy guy and I don't really see this making that much of a difference for him (which he has confirmed.)
Really the point of all this is he's a good friend of mine and he's a long ways from home going through some things that suck.
It was on my mind and I felt like posting up.
I don't have many people in my life that I would be really bothered if they went away.
I truly think he'll be fine. He has a great attitude toward all this and has already talked about a couple things he wants to do when he's back to running on the redline. He's one of the good ones. It would bother me if he went away.
Take a second and think a couple good thoughts for him and cross your fingers.
one of my neighbors who I am friendly with is just finishing VERY aggressive treatments he has undergone for his prostate ...HIS WAS STAGE 4 AND WENT UNDETECTED even though he had made complaints to his Dr about some of the symptoms he was experiencing that are markers for it...he is coming out the other side with the ability to be himself and continue being the head of household to his wife and 2 boys....so there is hope, if he is young/strong enough to withstand the treatments that lie ahead...
He just turned 60.
He looks like he's 50 though, and has a positive mental attitude.
3 things:
Viagra
Kegels for men
Good friend of mine had testicular cancer last year. Like your friend, had a great attitude and it served him well though the chemo.
What are the symptoms again?
There were none in this case.
Dr did the finger check and felt some hard spots so the investigation began.
I believe he was stage 3 of 4 (can't remember that detail exactly)
[hugs]
Sorry to hear. :(
Well wishes sent his way.
positive thoughts sent his way :)
you're a good friend kev
10-4
Thoughts and prayers deployed.
Quote from: Monsterlover on January 24, 2011, 01:32:18 PM
Take a second and think a couple good thoughts for him and cross your fingers.
Done. Sorry to hear ML. His positive attitude will no doubt serve him well. Keep us updated!
Prayers for a good outcome for your friend.
A friend of mine has had really high numbers on his PSA tests. He has had several tests over the last year or two and the numbers kept going up. He had (in his words) an excruciatingly painful prostate biopsy and in his heart he knew it would come back cancerous. It didn't! [bang] WTF?? He had more PSA tests and the numbers strangely went down then they went back up. Another God awful biopsy, this time 3 times as many samples!! He said he wanted to die it hurt so bad!!! Again, no cancer detected. Just weird as shit. He has all the test results of someone with prostate cancer, he doesn't have it and his doctors are clueless. Anyone else heard of this before?
For more of life's cruel tricks his wife just had breast cancer this last year. Chemo first, which seemed to help, then surgery to remove the lumps. No mastectomy and it had not spread to lymph nodes. She seems to be good to go for now. Thank God! Now he stays awake every night worrying about himself. :P
ML/Kevin, my thoughts and prayers go out to your boss and his family. [thumbsup]
Well, there's a least one person that was thinking of him in his time of need, thanks for sharing. I watched my dad go through the discovery and treatment for it. It's amazing what cancer treatments do to a person. I do hope all goes well for him!!!
JM
Thanks for the well wishes everyone
[thumbsup]
Best wishes to your boss, ML.
Positive thoughts and well wishes to your friend/boss.
Best thoughts from the wife and I to your boss.
Thought I'd update.
Seems he came out of the surgery really well [thumbsup]
Great to hear
Here's to speedy recovery and that they got it all
My Dad had it .
He was diagnosed w, it at a fairly old age . In his early 70s.
He was never treated for it due to his age.
In older patients the protocol is often watch and wait.
Often a patient will die of something other than the Prostate Cancer.
That's what happened to Dad.
He was a heavy smoker and didn't quit until he was 69.
He developed a Tumor in the Mediastinum, an Division of the Thorasic Cavity.
It was inoperable.
Dad later suffocated to death from the Tumor cutting off his Wind Pipe.
I pray for the good health of your friend .
Dolph
I'm happy to hear your Boss took the aggressive option, too often people opt for the easier way out, only to have it reappear and then they have to go through the whole thing again.
My wife went through breast cancer a couple years back and had to make a decision on what treatment to undergo, her options were basically as follows,
1) Have a lumpectomy to remove lump and then radiation to kill any cell left over.
2) Mastectomy to remove the breast along with reconstruction
3) Double mastectomy to remove both breast plus reconstruction.
She talked to quite a few breast cancer survivors and many had opted for options 1 or 2, only to have the cancer return and go through the whole ordeal again. So she decided to go for 3, the most aggressive approach. After surgery they tested the breast that did not have a lump and they detected early signs of cancer there as well that did not show up in the scans.
She is doing well now and very happy she went the more aggressive route.
Our thoughts and prayers to your Boss
Just found out my dad..well, technically my step-dad but still the dad who I grew up with..has prostate cancer. Last year, he had a bit of skin cancer removed and now it's come back. Surgery within the next few weeks to remove it. Stage 2..very aggresive.
Quote from: IZ on April 17, 2011, 11:22:15 AM
Just found out my dad..well, technically my step-dad but still the dad who I grew up with..has prostate cancer. Last year, he had a bit of skin cancer removed and now it's come back. Surgery within the next few weeks to remove it. Stage 2..very aggresive.
well shit
Quote from: Monsterlover on January 24, 2011, 01:32:18 PM
Last year, ok. This year, trouble.
In the course of a year he went from "fine" to "we need to fix this" :o
the cancer has not spread anywhere else, which is good.
they'll cut out the entire prostate
This likely will leave him non functional, sexually. He's pretty well married to his job,
He's a pretty happy guy and I don't really see this making that much of a difference for him (which he has confirmed.)
Quote from: Monsterlover on January 24, 2011, 01:52:49 PM
He just turned 60.
He looks like he's 50 though, and has a positive mental attitude.
This is pretty much the exact same scenario.
How is your boss/friend doing ML?
IZ,
He's doing quite well!
His surgery removed a nerve pack as it had started to spread there.
It took him some time to relearn to "pinch it off" and now he can get through the night without trouble.
He is now starting to get back on his normal sleep schedule (and work schedule)
All in all I'd call this a success. He still will need to go back for followup and what not, so he's not out of the woods just yet, but he's on his way.
Best wishes for your dad.
Positive mental attitude has everything to do with the degree of success.
Quote from: Monsterlover on April 17, 2011, 12:13:22 PM
He's doing quite well!
It took him some time to relearn to "pinch it off" and now he can get through the night without trouble.
Good to hear.
Dad will have to go through the same training.
Unlike you're boss though, he's doing the Da Vince robotic surgery. The surgeons put in 6 small holes rather than cutting him fully open. Since it is aggressive though, I don't know why they are taking a month to do it?!
Sh*tty timing since he just retired last summer from GM, bought a place on the lake and totally restored it. Hopefully, he'll have several years left to enjoy it.
Sorry to hear that news, IZ.
Here's to a quick & thorough recovery!
Our wishes are with you, your Dad and family. Good stepfathers do count as dads [thumbsup]
Quote from: IZ on April 17, 2011, 12:35:18 PM
Sh*tty timing since he just retired last summer from GM, bought a place on the lake and totally restored it. Hopefully, he'll have several years left to enjoy it.
:-\
Reminds me of my Dad, retire at 59 to do what you want on a lake and suddenly pass away at 62. I truly hope yours has more luck.
Best wishes to ML's boss also. Finding out you have cancer has to be one of the more stressful things a person can go through.....
Just heard the news last night that my dad has prostate cancer now too. He went in for a biopsy last week immediately following my uncle who went in for a 6 hour surgery (which turned into 12 hours) to remove his pancreas, spleen and a few other parts. We just found out he had pancreatic cancer two weeks ago. Uncle appears to be doing ok but he went down from 175lbs to 125lbs in the last coupke months. Unfortunately, he didnt gonto the doctor. Now the chemo starts for him.
The doctors say that my dad's cancer appears to be contained in the prostate. Hopefully, everything turns out OK. If you scroll up to my last few comments in this thread, you'll see my step-dad had prostate cancer about a year ago. He's doing well so this news really hasn't hit me too hard yet.
Sorry to hear the news.
Cancer has hit my family hard the last few years as well.
Mom--> pancreatic cancer
Uncle--> malignant metastatic prostate cancer
Father in law--> Lymphoma
They have all passed.
Spend time with your unc., pancreatic is almost impossible to beat.
Quote from: Speedbag on April 18, 2011, 03:20:42 PM
:-\
Reminds me of my Dad, retire at 59 to do what you want on a lake and suddenly pass away at 62. I truly hope yours has more luck.
Never saw that comment Speed. As I just mentioned, my Stepdad is doing well after having prostate removed. He bought a second house on a lake in MI and a few lawn/gardening toys to go with it, ie: tractor, 4 wheeler, etc. :)
My biological father just mentioned retirement for the very first time to me about 2 months ago. This is a kick in the balls. [thumbsdown]
Pedro..I wish I could. I'm in TX and he and most of the family are back in MI. At least his kids and brothers and sisters are all there.
My half sister had skin, my mom had breast, my grandma had breast, etc. :-X
I hope everything works out well for your friend/boss ML
good thing he has been tracking it and was able to address it when the time arrived to :-\
Guess I could update.
He's doing ok. With no prostate his psa should be about zero but its not. It's slowly rising :(
Doctors are concerned and are talking more treatment but I don't think he's interested. He guesses a 10 year life span if untreated with 5-8 good quality.
Longer span with treatment but only a few good quality years.
He's the type of guy to decided when enough is enough, stare down death and say bring it on.
CUCK FANCER !!!
there was a comment a while back about a positive PSA test but no cancer detected with biopsy.
that's the essential reason the medical community is turning away from PSA ... it doesn't really
appear to be a statistically useful predictor. unfortunately, the only non-invasive predictor
is the ol' fickle finger of fate. as unpleasant as that is, i would highly recommend this at least
once a year for anyone over 50.
also ... there appears to be two varieties of prostate cancer ... slow growing vs. fast. its the
fast kind that kills. most of us will have the slow kind when we go into he dark.
Quote from: abby normal on November 21, 2012, 07:05:34 AM
there was a comment a while back about a positive PSA test but no cancer detected with biopsy.
that's the essential reason the medical community is turning away from PSA ... it doesn't really
appear to be a statistically useful predictor. unfortunately, the only non-invasive predictor
is the ol' fickle finger of fate. as unpleasant as that is, i would highly recommend this at least
once a year for anyone over 50.
also ... there appears to be two varieties of prostate cancer ... slow growing vs. fast. its the
fast kind that kills. most of us will have the slow kind when we go into he dark.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This
Quote from: abby normal on November 21, 2012, 07:05:34 AM
there was a comment a while back about a positive PSA test but no cancer detected with biopsy.
that's the essential reason the medical community is turning away from PSA ... it doesn't really
appear to be a statistically useful predictor. unfortunately, the only non-invasive predictor
is the ol' fickle finger of fate. as unpleasant as that is, i would highly recommend this at least
once a year for anyone over 50.
also ... there appears to be two varieties of prostate cancer ... slow growing vs. fast. its the
fast kind that kills. most of us will have the slow kind when we go into he dark.
Interesting...my sister's husband has gone through the op/radiotherapy mill, the Docs seem to be stuck on this PSA thing where the reading should be zero but isn't. It's steady at a low level and causing him and his wife no end of anxiety. Time for some more research methinks.
If I recall correctly, the last big study which showed no statistical benefit
Of the PSA test was in England, so maybe the report would be in lancet.
I'll see if I can find it. Your experience is precisely why it's not being
Recommended ... False positive followed by painful and unnecessary biopsy.
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(12)61232-X/fulltext# (http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(12)61232-X/fulltext#)
There's a link to an article discussing current thinking on the PSA test.
Lots of differing opinions right now as the medical community tries to
Sort out the standard of care.
Whatever you decide about PSA, there's no reason to not get the finger.
That's the life saver.
Quote from: zooom on November 21, 2012, 05:40:04 AM
CUCK FANCER !!!
This.
I'll be 44 in March. That means I have six years to convince myself that getting probed might be fun. Then again, my doc
is sorta hot....
Definitely not fun. But is a finger up the a$$ once a year a reasonable
Price for life? I know lots of guys 50-60 who have never done this
Out of fear or embarrassment. Just do it. It's the current standard
Of practice. Every GP knows how to do it.
Quote from: abby normal on November 23, 2012, 08:02:25 AM
Definitely not fun. But is a finger up the a$$ once a year a reasonable
Price for life? I know lots of guys 50-60 who have never done this
Out of fear or embarrassment. Just do it. It's the current standard
Of practice. Every GP knows how to do it.
Not according to the USPTF.
Joint decision making, patient and provider, is the way to go.
Joint decision making is fine, but useless without some kind of
Diagnostic tool. Currently the preferred tool is the finger.
No pun intended. Get it or not. The decision is yours.
No it's not.
It's neither sensitive nor specific.
DRE misses half of all cancers.
USPTF states there to be inconclusive data to support the use of DRE.
Hence, the best approach is joint decision making.
Many factors influence going forward with prostate screening.
Medical history
Family history
Age
Etc
Interpretation of meta analysis is left up to expert panels, which is why there's so much conflicting info out there. I for one do not want to add to that confusion, but I find it difficult to say nothing when I see posts making broad statements on recommendations.
Don't mean to "argue" with ya. Again, get that finger all you want. I'm just saying.
Quote from: Pedro-bot on November 23, 2012, 01:21:51 PM
No it's not.
It's neither sensitive nor specific.
DRE misses half of all cancers.
USPTF states there to be inconclusive data to support the use of DRE.
Hence, the best approach is joint decision making.
Many factors influence going forward with prostate screening.
Medical history
Family history
Age
Etc
Interpretation of meta analysis is left up to expert panels, which is why there's so much conflicting info out there. I for one do not want to add to that confusion, but I find it difficult to say nothing when I see posts making broad statements on recommendations.
Don't mean to "argue" with ya. Again, get that finger all you want. I'm just saying.
Have you ever had that biopsy?
Quote from: ducpainter on November 24, 2012, 04:14:30 AM
Have you ever had that biopsy?
The recommendation from USPTF is for men NOT under servaillance or in active treatment. If YOU have, the "medical history" part applies to you. Meaning you are not in the randomized population studied for which current recommendations are interpreted from.
Me personally? Nope.
But there's a strong family history of cancer. See my earlier post in this thread.
Always, discuss concerns and questions regarding preventative health screenings with your medical provider.
Quote from: Pedro-bot on November 24, 2012, 06:09:26 AM
The recommendation from USPTF is for men NOT under servaillance or in active treatment. If YOU have, the "medical history" part applies to you. Meaning you are not in the randomized population studied for which current recommendations are interpreted from.
Me personally? Nope.
But there's a strong family history of cancer. See my earlier post in this thread.
My point is that even the biopsy can be inconclusive, and the PSA levels that they use to decide whether or not to perform this intrusive and expensive procedure is arbitrary. The actual PSA test has changed in the not too distant past.
How many biopsies do you subject yourself to before they find what they want to find? No money in not performing procedures.
Undergo the biopsy and get back to me with your thoughts about it.
Quote from: ducpainter on November 24, 2012, 06:18:13 AM
My point is that even the biopsy can be inconclusive, and the PSA levels that they use to decide whether or not to perform this intrusive and expensive procedure is arbitrary. The actual PSA test has changed in the not too distant past.
From your post I can read that you understand the confusion regarding when to screen. Which is why you make the point that screening can lead to find non-definitive information that leaves more questions than those very same questions it's purpose is meant to answer.
More questions leads to prostate biopsy. Biopsy results can put you back in square one. Sometimes.
Occasionally, less than 5% of the time, the biopsy detects a malignancy.
Given that this is a public forum, I want to make sure readers understand that what I am posting should not be used to make personal decisions. My message, to you the reader, is to always discuss this with your medical provider.
#1. The USPTF (US Preventative Task Force) is defined as the following:
Created in 1984, the U.S. Preventive Services Task Force (USPSTF or Task Force) is an independent group of national experts in prevention and evidence-based medicine that works to improve the health of all Americans by making evidence-based recommendations about clinical preventive services such as screenings, counseling services, or preventive medications.
#2 Prostate Cancer Screening is defined as such: DRE (digital rectal exam) in other words the ol' finger in the rectum routine. Routine screening can be with or without the PSA (prostate specific antigen) serum level (blood test).
#3. A biopsy is NOT a screening. Biopsy is a
diagnostic tool. This is invasive, expensive and sounds painful, which carries risks of its own.
Screening, such as the DRE, is an exam that distinguishes between normal and abnormal findings. Which if abnormal would then likely encourage you to escalate the level of care, i.e., PSA, biopsy, etc.
#4. USPTF made a recommendation around June of 2011 which made a recommendation AGAINST routine annual
screening (Means DRE and PSA) for MEN < 75 that are not in surveillance ( surveillance means you've been previously
successfully treated for prostate cancer and are being watched for a recurrence of it) and are not currently in treatment for prostate cancer (you have prostate cancer and are either receiving chemo, radiation therapy, surgery, etc.).
So again, if any of what's in parenthesis applies to you, the recommendation does NOT apply to you.
Why wound the USPTF say that?
Because after review of many large randomized studies (meta analysis), the benefits of routine screening did not have a significant impact on prevention.
For one, many prostate cancers can and do occur even in the normal range of a PSA (<4 ng/mL).
Number two, as I stated before, DRE misses half of all cancers. This means that those who did have prostate cancer, DRE was not sensitive enough to detect it.
Number three, PSA levels are also not very sensitive, nor specific.
And just to clarify:
PSA tests have
not changed.
What has changed is how that data is interpreted. Meaning, a good clinician doesn't just look for what that number is, but it looks at what it was before. The rate at which those two levels have changed is called velocity. This has implications of it's own. And I won't go into that.
QuoteHow many biopsies do you subject yourself to before they find what they want to find? No money in not performing procedures.
Your point is well made.
But I think you have me mistaken as being an advocate for screening indiscriminately.
The point you make is why urologist all over the U.S. threw their hands up in the air and screamed bloody murder when the USPTF made public the recommendation.
Who do you think performs all those biopsies and surgeries?
QuoteUndergo the biopsy and get back to me with your thoughts about it.
I hope I never have to. But given the strong family history, I'll make that decision together with my provider.
Just like everyone else should too. ;)
I agree with everything you said...
except the fact that the test has indeed changed. Both patients and providers had to recalibrate their thinking regarding results. I believe at the same time the 'normal' PSA level changed.
This occurred about 10 or 11 years ago.
Quote from: ducpainter on November 24, 2012, 02:11:32 PM
I agree with everything you said...
<SNIP>
Really?! Gee thanks. ;D
And here I was not agreeing with lick of what you said. [cheeky]
But in all seriousness, one thing I know we can both agree on is cancer does in fact suck the big one. [thumbsdown]
Quote from: Pedro-bot on November 24, 2012, 03:02:08 PM
Really?! Gee thanks. ;D
And here I was not agreeing with lick of what you said. [cheeky]
But in all seriousness, one thing I know we can both agree on is cancer does in fact suck the big one. [thumbsdown]
Certainly does.
It touches everyone, and never in a
good way.
Well shit.
Uncle's pancreatic cancer..I mentioned in Nov..took its course. He rec'd news of 3 months to live <4 weeks ago. Tonight, it's doubtful he'll make it through the week. At least he's at home with all of the family.
Dad's surgery for prostate cancer happened 2 weeks ago. The results, 1 week later, showed the cancer is worse than they thought.
Well shit again.
sorry to hear Iz.
Oh no IZ! I'm so sorry to see this!
Wishing you as much peace as conceivably possible.... :'(
Quote from: Stella on March 04, 2013, 09:25:26 PM
Oh no IZ! I'm so sorry to see this!
Wishing you as much peace as conceivably possible.... :'(
+1
My thoughts are with you and yours IZ.
Argh..thanks all. Wasn't expecting either of these outcomes. Uncle is now unresponsive and not eating or drinking. Last rights given.
This cancer thing though is sucking! Aunt passed away on Thanksgiving from it and my uncle..her husband..just died two weeks ago from it. Didn't tell family he had it so that was a shock. Another aunt just diagnosed with it a week ago.
Nothing I can do but days like this, it does suck being 1000 miles away from family.
Sorry dude. :'(
A chick I know (37) recently found out she has ovarian cancer and just had a hysterectomy to get rid of it. She's devastated.
[thumbsdown] [thumbsdown]
Sorry your family has been hit with so much, so quickly IZ. Wishing you all the strength you need to support each other.
Quote from: IZ on March 04, 2013, 08:35:18 PM
Well shit.
Uncle's pancreatic cancer..I mentioned in Nov..took its course. He rec'd news of 3 months to live <4 weeks ago. Tonight, it's doubtful he'll make it through the week. At least he's at home with all of the family.
Dad's surgery for prostate cancer happened 2 weeks ago. The results, 1 week later, showed the cancer is worse than they thought.
Well shit again.
Sorry to hear of your family's bouts with the cancer
I have a friend who had a lousy prostate removed and the aftermath was not pretty, metastasis
that was 15 years ago and he is still going... but is just now running out of options
these days with the treatments available they can buy you years of good quality co-existence with the illness even if they can't get you into remission
right now I don't know what my prospects are for remission
don't much care either if they can buy me 10 or 15 years...
I really don't think I want to live that far into my 70's anyway
good luck!
Quote from: IZ on March 04, 2013, 08:35:18 PM
Uncle's pancreatic cancer..I mentioned in Nov..took its course. He rec'd news of 3 months to live <4 weeks ago. Tonight, it's doubtful he'll make it through the week. At least he's at home with all of the family.
Got the news a couple hours ago. Three months to live turned out to be a little over one.
Quote from: IZ on March 08, 2013, 09:03:28 PM
Got the news a couple hours ago. Three months to live turned out to be a little over one.
Sorry for your loss.
Sorry IZ ...... what to say... :(
Sorry Adam.
Sorry to hear this
Sorry, man :(
Thanks all.
After hearing the details last night, that one month was about two weeks too long. This is definitely for the best.
:(
Sorry to hear that news, Adam.
My condolences to your family.
:'(
So sorry Adam...
My condolences.
Adam, my condolences to you and your family. :(