I have a situation at work. I was hired last May with the understanding that I would do office work for 3 months and then get moved to training. This has not happened yet. The office work is mind numbingly boring. I can get it all done in under 2 hours each day. It may spike up a few hours if someone is out sick.
I was given an independent contractor contract to sign. They want me to teach a few classes. If I do this, I have to sign the contract. It states that I can not take a vacation day on the day I teach.
Lets say I am contracted to teach a class on Thursday. I would get the contracted rate of $250 for the day. I would not get my regular pay. My pay check at the 2 week point would be a day short. I am paid by the hour.
The contract states that I am not allowed to take a vacation day on the day I teach. This pisses me off.
In essence, I am not getting $250 for the day of teaching. I am getting the difference from what I would be making at my hourly rate.
The boss says that there is no "double dipping" allowed. I stated that if they hired a different person to teach they would still be out the money.
Am I being unreasonable here? What I really want is a better wage and would do the office work and teach. They will not do that either.
Tell the boss if there's no double dipping then he can't have you as both an hourly employee and an independent contractor.
Goose and gander type thing you know. ;D
Then walk out...wait...
don't necessarily do what I'd do.
It can provide for lean times. ;)
He was mad and defensive the whole time. I could live with it he pretended to understand my position.
It doesn't seem you have a choice, other than to find new employment.
Quote from: kopfjäger on January 10, 2013, 06:41:00 PM
It doesn't seem you have a choice, other than to find new employment.
Looking. Does not help that the office moved and my daily commute went from 3 miles round trip to 42.
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 10, 2013, 06:43:51 PM
Looking. Does not help that the office moved and my daily commute went from 3 miles round trip to 42.
Ouch, All I have to offer is keep looking.
If you are doing Contract work, you should be doing it as an LLC.
Possibly a different spin but what if you did the contractual teaching (under an LLC as Kopf suggests - not as a C Corp as i highly suggest you avoid) for the sole purpose of building your own consulting/teaching credentials so you can eventually build your own business and not deal with these issues (but oh so many others). ;)
Food (protein-laden omelette style) for thought.
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 10, 2013, 06:40:27 PM
He was mad and defensive the whole time. I could live with it he pretended to understand my position.
I couldn't live with his double standard.
I just thank God that I'm retired (or is it retarded)... ;) ;)
I'd hate to have to suffer the kind of shit that seems to go with jobs these days... [bang]
Geoff... [coffee]
Quote from: ducpainter on January 10, 2013, 07:10:16 PM
I couldn't live with his double standard.
Really, neither can I.
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 10, 2013, 09:13:52 PM
Really, neither can I.
Truth is you can't be both at the same job.
Either you're an employee and get paid salary or hourly, or your a contract employee and you get paid according to the contract.
Run as fast as you can.
If you are truly doing contract work, you should get 2 paychecks: one for your hourly work made out to you, and one for your contract work made out to the name of your business.
The legal/accounting status of a contractor is very different than that of an employee.
I would be pissed too.
Quote from: ducpainter on January 11, 2013, 04:04:29 AM
Truth is you can't be both at the same job.
Either you're an employee and get paid salary or hourly, or your a contract employee and you get paid according to the contract.
^^ This
Quote from: ducpainter on January 11, 2013, 04:04:29 AMRun as fast as you can.
Ideally this too... although having bills to pay can mess with ideals somewhat :-\
Quote from: DesmoDiva on January 11, 2013, 04:47:01 AM
If you are truly doing contract work, you should get 2 paychecks: one for your hourly work made out to you, and one for your contract work made out to the name of your business.
The legal/accounting status of a contractor is very different than that of an employee.
I would be pissed too.
Yes, 2 separate checks. They have muddied the waters by saying that I would still accrue vacation and sick pay on days I was not on the company clock and working as a contractor.
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 11, 2013, 05:24:09 AM
Yes, 2 separate checks. They have muddied the waters by saying that I would still accrue vacation and sick pay on days I was not on the company clock and working as a contractor.
[bang]
That's not (technically) legal...
How are you suppose to show income (and take the tax write-offs) for your business if that income is bundled into your hourly paycheck?
Personally, I would think having you do the work as a contractor, completely legally and financially, separate from your hourly work would be better for them.
Quote from: ducpainter on January 10, 2013, 06:36:13 PM
<snip>
Then walk out...wait...
don't necessarily do what I'd do.
It can provide for lean times. ;)
Quote from: ungeheuer on January 11, 2013, 05:22:43 AM
<snip>
Ideally this too... although having bills to pay can mess with ideals somewhat :-\
I already added a disclaimer... ;)
I have a full time office job there as the safety & health program coordinator.
Instruction, or teaching classes is not my job, so they want to use me as needed as a contractor. If the contract classes were on sat, sun, or after 5 PM, there would be no issue.
I am not going to sign the paper. I will continue on with my boring office work and look elsewhere.
I have no desire to work for myself as a full time contractor. I like having coworkers, an office to go to, a steady (regular) pay check, etc.
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 11, 2013, 05:46:49 AM
I have a full time office job there as the safety & health program coordinator.
Instruction, or teaching classes is not my job, so they want to use me as needed as a contractor. If the contract classes were on sat, sun, or after 5 PM, there would be no issue.
I am not going to sign the paper. I will continue on with my boring office work and look elsewhere.
I have no desire to work for myself as a full time contractor. I like having coworkers, an office to go to, a steady (regular) pay check, etc.
Best of luck LMT... ((Hugs from NM))
I've re-read your first post a couple times and I don't get it. Why the need to re-classify your status on training days? Why can't you just teach those days and it count as your regular hours? What is the advantage of what the boss is trying to do? Conversely, why is agreeing not to take a day off on days you are scheduled to teach an issue? Aren't they scheduled well in advance?
Lastly. When the commute jumped up and the company wasn't following through with their promises, I would have walked.
being the payroll expert that i am [roll] ;D, you can actually have 2 classifications (employee & 1099) at a job as long as the positions don't overlap & one of the jobs youre doing qualifies for a 1099 classification
for example, you work retail during the day & after hours, as a side job, you design the companies website.. during the day you would be an employee & after hours you would be 1099
1099 classifications do not usually accrue vacation...
to me, your description of the job doesn't qualify for the 1099 classification.. but you can verify the classification with the IRS
http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small-Businesses-&-Self-Employed/Independent-Contractor-%28Self-Employed%29-or-Employee%3F (http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Small-Businesses-&-Self-Employed/Independent-Contractor-%28Self-Employed%29-or-Employee%3F)
there's a form you can complete to get their determination..
to me it sounds like your employer is using this as a workaround to reduce their payroll taxes & potential overtime
if the classification can truly be considered 1099, then I see both your position, as well as the companies..
so, if i'm understanding correctly, if you want to take a week off & there is a class that you are scheduled for on thursday, you would only be paid for monday, tuesday, wednesday & friday, correct?
My questions are:
1. how far in advance are the teaching schedules made?
2. how far in advance do you have to schedule time off?
We are a small non-profit and set in our ways. There is a very strong division between training and office workers. We have 2 full time trainers and use a ton of contract instructors. This month there are 33 classes scheduled around the PNW.
I offered to teach at my regular rate and they said no, I had to do it as a contractor.
Not in any position to walk away from a steady pay check.
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 11, 2013, 01:02:27 PM
We are a small non-profit and set in our ways. There is a very strong division between training and office workers. We have 2 full time trainers and use a ton of contract instructors. This month there are 33 classes scheduled around the PNW.
I offered to teach at my regular rate and they said no, I had to do it as a contractor.
Not in any position to walk away from a steady pay check.
nonprofit or not, the irs sets the ways ;)
Quote from: elyse on January 11, 2013, 01:01:28 PM
to me, your description of the job doesn't qualify for the 1099 classification.. but you can verify the classification with the IRS
[so, if i'm understanding correctly, if you want to take a week off & there is a class that you are scheduled for on thursday, you would only be paid for monday, tuesday, wednesday & friday, correct?
It is not about getting time off. I work M - F 8 to 5 and get paid by the hour to do so. I can take a day off and use vacation or sick leave no problem. If I come to work on a Thursday and teach a class, for my regular pay check, it is a day off without pay.
Instead, I get the contract rate of $250 for the day.
If I teach a couple of times a week, my regular paycheck will be much smaller. The contract check will have no taxes taken out.
So the contract rate of $250/day is less than you make in your hourly position for a day (after considering ~30% removed for taxes)?
If not, then I don't see the big deal with not getting paid the hourly rate the days you teach. Your paycheck will be smaller sure, but you'll have been paid the contract rate for the days you taught so it should roughly even out.
The vacation thing sucks since I don't see how that costs them more than if they just pay you for a reglarly use vacation day, but it doesn't seem like that big of a deal. No one lets an hourly employee take a vacation day and then show up to work anyway and get paid again...which is kind of the same.
Am I missing something?
Quote from: Little Monkey Toes on January 11, 2013, 01:08:19 PM
It is not about getting time off. I work M - F 8 to 5 and get paid by the hour to do so. I can take a day off and use vacation or sick leave no problem. If I come to work on a Thursday and teach a class, for my regular pay check, it is a day off without pay.
Instead, I get the contract rate of $250 for the day.
If I teach a couple of times a week, my regular paycheck will be much smaller. The contract check will have no taxes taken out.
ok, i get it now.. i dont necessarily think that's legal either.... because to have the 2 separate classification, means the work situation should be 2 separate entities..part of being classified 1099 means that the employer has a "lack of control", by denying the vacation time to the "employee" in order to pay as 1099, would exhibit a control factor.. i wouldnt sign anything either...
What is this "paid vacation" you speak of? Never had one.
My totally non professional opinion:
Getting paid for your day's work and getting paid as a contractor is double dipping.
Working as a contractor on your vacation day is not double dipping.
No, you are not being unreasonable. Reality is in the present job market the employer has the upper hand though.
Quote from: howie on January 11, 2013, 08:58:37 PM
My totally non professional opinion:
Getting paid for your day's work and getting paid as a contractor is double dipping.
Working as a contractor on your vacation day is not double dipping.
No, you are not being unreasonable. Reality is in the present job market the employer has the upper hand though.
Working as a contractor for the same company on a paid vacation day is double dipping. Working for yourself or for another company on unrelated work on a paid vacation day is fine. I'm not allowed to work OT on a vacation day at the PD but I can work my 2nd job all I want. They are unrelated. I can however, work OT on a holiday and get paid 26.75 hours for 12.5 hours of work. [thumbsup]