Ducati Monster Forum

I am just walking in the door from work when my phone starts ringing. It *looks* like the number for my daughter's school down in Missouri so I ignore it. They call about 5 times a week with announcements. So I am jaded.

But they call back...again...and again and again...then I get a text from my youngest daughter..."Dad, you need to answer that call. It's important."

Phone starts ringing again. And I answer it.

It is my ex-wife's ex-sister in law, Carolyn. Her and my ex wife stayed friends after her second and third divorces. My ex wife's life sort of fell apart after we split up but I got my shit together and went forward.

Anyway, Carolyn informs me that my youngest daughter has just been made a ward of the state of Missouri. But Carolyn has been granted temporary custody until the hearing.
What hearing?
Well apparently, my ex wife and her boyfriend had a nice meth lab set up in the bedroom at his place. Turns out that my ex's third husband has gotten out of jail, tracked her down to that house and commences to whoop the snot out of her. Then he bails, goes to the local sheriff's office and turns himself in...and makes mention of the meth lab.
So the sheriff goes to investigate and finds enough meth and an active lab to make it a federal level case.
They arrest my ex wife and her boyfriend and take them to the jail.
They send a deputy to the ex's house and find my 2 daughters there. My middle daughter just turned 18 today. My youngest is 15. (My oldest is with a different woman and has nothing to do with this fascinating story) They transport them both to the law enforcement center and make them both take drug tests.
My youngest is clean. My middle daughter tests positive for meth. They also find a small amount on her...enough to pop a possession charge.

So, because they are in Missouri, my youngest has been made a ward of the state. Fortunately, Carolyn is a state certified foster care provider. They do a walk through of her home and place my youngest in her home. I don't like Carolyn all that much but...it is better than the alternative.

As if it weren't weird enough, I call down to the sheriff's department in Missouri and they inform me that even though I have joint custody, their jurisdiction supersedes my parental rights. But they are willing to hold a hearing about custody sometime in the next 30 to 60 days.
Seriously? I am her father. I have loads of paperwork that says so. I have a court order from the state of Iowa that says so and says that I have joint custody.

I call my attorney (friends with him outside of the courtroom...we are both "single" fathers). He can't do much tonight but he will start making calls first thing in the morning.
My middle daughter was released on her own recognizance but has since disappeared. Her boyfriend is in rehab and she has recently alienated most of her friends so no idea where she is. She had no license, no car and no money so I am *hoping* she is back at her mom's house at least. If I don't hear anything from her by tomorrow afternoon, I will be heading down there to try and find her.

Everything seems surreal. The odd part is that I am not surprised in the least about the whole meth lab thing with their mom. My wife and I both noticed a serious change in my ex wife when we were down there to drop my girls off after Christmas. We both joked that she looked like she was living on equal doses of meth and pixie sticks. Guess we weren't too far off.

I was speaking with my youngest a bit ago and she wants to come up here but can't until after the hearing. But she was talking about how her mom was doing it for quite some time and her boyfriend talked her into helping make it and how her mom was telling both girls all about it.
When I asked her why she didn't call me, she said it was because she thought I would get mad. Gee...ya make the beast with two backsin' think?

Anyway, I am mentally drained. Just feel like when everything in my life is sunshine and roses, I find a big fat make the beast with two backsing pile of cow shit to step in.

I have no real advice, the situation is far beyond anything I've ever had to deal with.

Best of luck!

Others here should have something more directly helpful to say.

Just needed a sounding board. Sort of like you're walking down the street and some random person just hauls off and punches you in the dick for no apparent reason.

I'm reading this after getting home from our eighth weekly foster parenting certification class (long story), and this is as bad as anything we've heard in class - and they're trying to scare us a little.

All I can think to add is that your willingness to go to the rescue speaks volumes to your daughters right now.  Strong and steady is something they probably haven't seen since the last time they were with you.

Oh, and good luck. Lots of it.

Damn...sorry to hear that she got the kids involved.  :-X


My TV is down though so I guess I know what to tune into for the next couple months!  [popcorn]

Hoping for some positive outcomes!

Quote from: triangleforge on February 28, 2013, 09:03:31 PM
All I can think to add is that your willingness to go to the rescue speaks volumes to your daughters right now.  Strong and steady is something they probably haven't seen since the last time they were with you.

Oh, and good luck. Lots of it.

Quote from: IZ on February 28, 2013, 10:48:13 PM
Damn...sorry to hear that she got the kids involved.  Hoping for some positive outcomes!

+ INFINITY!!!

My attorney has made several calls so far and hasn't gotten a hold of anyone who can give him any answers yet outside of general, "this is what Missouri law says" kind of crap.

A whole lot of hurrying up and waiting going on right now.

My thoughts are with you...

I've had some unsavory dealings w/my ex-wife and my kid but nothing like you've outlined...

Hi... My name is Joel, I'm also a member of the " i put my penis in satan years ago" club

Initial custody hearing on Monday afternoon for my youngest. My middle daughter said she would "think about" coming and staying with us. She is staying with a friend but won't tell me where.

The process for custody of my youngest goes like this:
1. Initial hearing...informal and only establishes the state's right to take custody. They can also mention to the DHS officer that I want custody.
2. Formal hearing to request custody. April 1st. At that point the state of Missouri requests a home study from the state of Iowa on my residence/person.
3. Wait. The case worker said that it could take up to 6 months before Missouri grants me custody. She doesn't doubt they will but the process is "time consuming".

BTW, for anyone who is curious, this is what my ex wife is being charged with:
1) FELONY POSSESSION OF A CONTROLLED SUBSTANCE- METHAMPHETAMINE
2) FELONY ATTEMPT TO MANUFACTURE A CONTROLLED SUBSTANCE- METHAMPHETAMINE
3) FELONY DISTRIBUTION OF A CONTROLLED SUBSTANCE- METHAMPHETAMINE
4) FELONY CHILD ENDANGERMENT
5) UNLAWFUL USE OF DRUG PARAPHERNALIA

4 felonies and a serious misdemeanor in Missouri.
On top of that, more federal charges are pending as they apparently found a large number of guns, knives, swords and "maces" along with the drugs. They also found a mecury switch rigged up to a primitive gumpowder and gasoline bomb in her boyfriend's car.

All in all, I am pretty sure that my ex won't see our daughters outside of a prison visiting area for a very long time.

as Guy Fieri would say....

Winne Winner chicken dinner!

good luck and I am sorry that you have to go through this arduous process...but it sounds like it may be for what is best in all of this...

Quote from: ZILBERT on February 28, 2013, 08:52:26 PM
Sort of like you're walking down the street and some random person just hauls off and punches you in the dick for no apparent reason.

This happens to you too?!?!?!?  [laugh]

But seriously, that is a mess....and good luck. This makes my occasionally f'ed up life seem like a walk in the park.

HFS

dude, I am so sorry..

Quote from: ducatiz on March 01, 2013, 12:35:14 PM
HFS

dude, I am so sorry..

Yeah, that's about all I can think as well  :-\

Crossing my fingers for a good outcome my friend.

Quotegood luck and I am sorry that you have to go through this arduous process...but it sounds like it may be for what is best in all of this...

believe it or not this is the truth, it gets your girls out of the s**t. as soon as you can scoop up them up, bring them home and give them all the love they deserve.

be strong

GODAM!!  That's a whole lot of a mess that just dumped on you.  Sorry that you're having to deal with all this this, but I hope for the best. 

Quote from: IZ on February 28, 2013, 10:48:13 PM
My TV is down though so I guess I know what to tune into for the next couple months!  [popcorn]

Not only is he a hobbit, he's also a dick.

crazy shit
you've got our moral support and ear for ranting to

Quote from: DRKWNG on March 01, 2013, 04:33:04 PM
GODAM!!  That's a whole lot of a mess that just dumped on you.  Sorry that you're having to deal with all this this, but I hope for the best. 

Not only is he a hobbit, he's also a dick.

I'm pretty sure he didn't mean it that way.

At least I hope.

It's more fun to imagine.

Maybe I missed it...you live in a different State? I'm wondering why the PD didn't call you to come get the youngest.

Quote from: hbliam on March 01, 2013, 09:08:49 PM
Maybe I missed it...you live in a different State? I'm wondering why the PD didn't call you to come get the youngest.

She and I have joint custody with her as the custodial guardian.
She moved to Missouri after we divorced.
Once she did that, Missouri law superseded all Iowa law for custody/protective custody.
All Iowa laws in relation to financial and medical support for the children take precedence.

If I lived in Missouri, they would have called me and had me come and pick them up.
But since I live in another state, the state of Missouri takes protective custody of the minor child.
The process Missouri follows is that I have to petition for her to be released to my custody. (That's the hearing on Monday)
Missouri then sets a formal hearing where I plead my case. The state caseworkers would *typically* then argue for the child to be returned to the custodial parent's home as long as certain stipulations are met. In this case, that won't happen.
The state of Missouri will say something to the effect that they believe my daughter should be placed in my home.
The magistrate or judge will then order Missouri to do a home study of my residence and interviews of me and anyone else in the household (my wife).
But since I live in Iowa, they have to petition Iowa to do the home study.
Once the home study is complete, the state of Iowa sends its findings to the state of Missouri.
The caseworkers will then request another hearing to enter in the new information with the magistrate or judge.
At that time, the judge has up to 60 days to review all details of the case and make a final disposition.

According to the juvenile officer and the caseworker from Missouri, because I live in another state, this potentially could take up to 6 months. She doesn't see it taking that long but then they still have to follow their procedures.


As for the mom...bail's been set at $500,000 cash only.

Quote from: ZILBERT on March 01, 2013, 10:42:23 PM
She and I have joint custody with her as the custodial guardian.
She moved to Missouri after we divorced.
Once she did that, Missouri law superseded all Iowa law for custody/protective custody.
All Iowa laws in relation to financial and medical support for the children take precedence.

If I lived in Missouri, they would have called me and had me come and pick them up.
But since I live in another state, the state of Missouri takes protective custody of the minor child.
The process Missouri follows is that I have to petition for her to be released to my custody. (That's the hearing on Monday)
Missouri then sets a formal hearing where I plead my case. The state caseworkers would *typically* then argue for the child to be returned to the custodial parent's home as long as certain stipulations are met. In this case, that won't happen.
The state of Missouri will say something to the effect that they believe my daughter should be placed in my home.
The magistrate or judge will then order Missouri to do a home study of my residence and interviews of me and anyone else in the household (my wife).
But since I live in Iowa, they have to petition Iowa to do the home study.
Once the home study is complete, the state of Iowa sends its findings to the state of Missouri.
The caseworkers will then request another hearing to enter in the new information with the magistrate or judge.
At that time, the judge has up to 60 days to review all details of the case and make a final disposition.

According to the juvenile officer and the caseworker from Missouri, because I live in another state, this potentially could take up to 6 months. She doesn't see it taking that long but then they still have to follow their procedures.


As for the mom...bail's been set at $500,000 cash only.

If an Iowa court issued a custody order that you both accepted, then Missouri would abide by that provided it comported with Missouri law (and that means only egregious issues, like underage marriage not normal stuff).  You just need to file in Missouri to have the Iowa custody order enforced in Missouri.

Your custody does not change when she crosses state lines.  It gets complicated, but Missouri cannot undo a custody order that is uncontested. 

There is no "precedence" with regard to divorce/custody issues once final.

HOWEVER the issue here is that the child was taken into protective custody by the state because she was in a dangerous situation, and that's wholly different from the divorce custody.  You have to show up because you're out of state, but that doesn't override the original custody order.  The Missouri court wants to make sure you're legit because it knows nothing of YOU or the original custody order.  Technically, despite being in jail, your ex still has a legal right (in IOWA) to sue for custody until that order is amended. 

Bring the original custody agreement with you from the IOWA court.  The Missouri court will probably question you some regarding your living status, job, etc, but will release her to you.  You need to state that you will seek to have the original custody order amended to REMOVE your ex's custody rights.

And make sure you have an attorney worth a shit.  Bring an original copy of the custody order (or a "true copy").

Quote from: DRKWNG on March 01, 2013, 04:33:04 PM
Not only is he a hobbit, he's also a dick.

Quote from: Monsterlover on March 01, 2013, 06:37:11 PM
I'm pretty sure he didn't mean it that way.
At least I hope.

Seriously..

..didn't read the first or third line?  Come on.  [roll]

When someone here says he feels like Piller, I would assume that he still has some humor and a popcorn-eating emoticon is hardly a kick in the balls.

If I do have to do some explaining though..in case anyone really cares or really was offended..like I said, my TV is down (there's a thread regarding it), my bike is totaled and I can't work out because of it.  So, I'll be checking in more to see where this goes.  Obviously, I hope it all works out for Z. 

If I did want to be a dick though..I could whine about Mods name calling, how my feelings got hurt by it and double standards.  [cheeky]

Back to the important stuff.   
 

Quote from: IZ on March 02, 2013, 10:59:06 AM

Seriously..

..didn't read the first or third line?  Come on.  [roll]

When someone here says he feels like Piller, I would assume that he still has some humor and a popcorn-eating emoticon is hardly a kick in the balls.

If I do have to do some explaining though..in case anyone really cares or really was offended..like I said, my TV is down (there's a thread regarding it), my bike is totaled and I can't work out because of it.  So, I'll be checking in more to see where this goes.  Obviously, I hope it all works out for Z. 

If I did want to be a dick though..I could whine about Mods name calling, how my feelings got hurt by it and double standards.  [cheeky]

Back to the important stuff.   
 

Calm down there IZ_... :-* ;)

This is why I worked in a felony criminal courthouse (and my wife still does) and not a civil courthouse dealing with civil lawsuits ($$$$) and family law mayhem. [bang] So much simpler and straight forward. Guilty/not guilty... next case.

Good luck Zilbert. I wish you and your children the best. Obviously your ex has flushed her life down the toilet. Hope you can salvage and save your kiddos and successfully wade through the court madness. [thumbsup] [beer]

Wow, shit man your life just entered a new reality....I know what that feels like

I am sorry you and your children have been injected into an episode of COPS

You are doing the right things, salvage the kids and get them far far away from the tweaker queen

in fact petition for sole custody given the horrific conditions your kids were exposed to

do not bank on the state keeping her locked up for as long as she deserves

Seriously, my heart goes out to you, and listen to Ducatiz...I believe these matters are an area of professional expertise in his portfolio

Good Luck!!  Stay on track and keep your composure when dealing with the State Apparatus

Quote from: IZ on March 02, 2013, 10:59:06 AM
If I did want to be a dick though..I could whine about Mods name calling, how my feelings got hurt by it and double standards.  [cheeky]

JuddDdDDddDDdD, what did you do with Adam?

;D

Quote from: DRKWNG on March 02, 2013, 11:59:59 AM
JuddDdDDddDDdD, what did you do with Adam?

;D

Now that..I take personally!

Quote from: ducatiz on March 02, 2013, 06:19:45 AM

If an Iowa court issued a custody order that you both accepted, then Missouri would abide by that provided it comported with Missouri law (and that means only egregious issues, like underage marriage not normal stuff).  You just need to file in Missouri to have the Iowa custody order enforced in Missouri.

Your custody does not change when she crosses state lines.  It gets complicated, but Missouri cannot undo a custody order that is uncontested. 

There is no "precedence" with regard to divorce/custody issues once final.

HOWEVER the issue here is that the child was taken into protective custody by the state because she was in a dangerous situation, and that's wholly different from the divorce custody.  You have to show up because you're out of state, but that doesn't override the original custody order.  The Missouri court wants to make sure you're legit because it knows nothing of YOU or the original custody order.  Technically, despite being in jail, your ex still has a legal right (in IOWA) to sue for custody until that order is amended. 

Bring the original custody agreement with you from the IOWA court.  The Missouri court will probably question you some regarding your living status, job, etc, but will release her to you.  You need to state that you will seek to have the original custody order amended to REMOVE your ex's custody rights.

And make sure you have an attorney worth a shit.  Bring an original copy of the custody order (or a "true copy").

They already have a certified copy of the original custody order from the Iowa courts. The magistrate who issued the order to place my youngest into protective custody "overrode" that order.
Citing that in the case of a child being in a dangerous situation, the state has rights to supersede all previous custody orders.
I'm not a lawyer. But I have an excellent family law attorney who has been with me for the over 17 years that this has been going on (custody, child support, etc) and he even claims his hands are tied until after the hearing on Monday. He said that even his good friend who is a practicing attorney in Missouri had nothing to offer beyond what we have been told so far.

I will be bringing the original custody order with me tomorrow but from what I have been told, no arguments/evidence can be presented at this hearing only that this hearing establishes the state's right to place the minor child into protective custody "officially".
From what I have found so far, Missouri has completely ignored the original Iowa custody order. That one stated that I was to have my daughters every other weekend and every Tuesday/Thursday. It noted that if she moved out of the area, that a new order would have to be issued to amend the custody and visitation.
It said that she could not move out of state without first having the custody and visitation amended.
She moved out of state.
She didn't tell anyone until 6 weeks after doing it.
The state of Iowa held her in contempt.
The state of Missouri refused to "get in the middle"...until now.

"Until now"   

[thumbsdown]

Quote from: ZILBERT on March 03, 2013, 07:54:04 PM
They already have a certified copy of the original custody order from the Iowa courts. The magistrate who issued the order to place my youngest into protective custody "overrode" that order.
Citing that in the case of a child being in a dangerous situation, the state has rights to supersede all previous custody orders.

that's the key part.  the MO court has to make sure you're not part of the danger.  that you weren't somehow complicit or involved. 

Quote
It said that she could not move out of state without first having the custody and visitation amended.
She moved out of state.
She didn't tell anyone until 6 weeks after doing it.
The state of Iowa held her in contempt.
The state of Missouri refused to "get in the middle"...until now.

something is wrong then.  this is a common occurrence and we regularly get out of state courts to enforce this kind of order.  whatever corresponding court in MO should have had no problem enforcing the contempt charge, or the original order.

i can't comment specifically on your case, but my office regularly deals with this.. there must be something else involved.

however, when a child is in danger, all bets are (at least temporarily) off.

Hearing went well.
I mean as well as a hearing about your child's future because she was removed from the home of her meth lab entrepreneur mother's house...

So, I found out a little (and I mean little) bit more about why they won't just let me bring her home...apparently, once the child is placed into protective custody, this apparently supersedes any and all custody orders.
So even though we had joint custody, we are back at the proverbial square one.
But it isn't as bad as it sounds. The ball is rolling for the state of Missouri to place her in my care.
I called my attorney on the way home who will submit a revised custody order up here.
Once I am granted custody by Missouri, I can petition the state of Iowa to grant me sole custody. This then overwrites the Missouri "temporary" order.

You're right, Tiz...Missouri just wants to make sure they aren't moving her from one bad situation to another.

She did make it clear that she wants to finish out the school year in Missouri and the current care provider is 100% OK with her remaining there until then.

Just 3 more hearings to go.
The judge did order that I am to have full permissions to take her for visitations any time I want as long as the case worker knows where she is at all times.


My 18 yo is having a hard time deciding what she wants. She claims that she wants to be there for her mom "in case something happens in the middle of the night and they need me".
She went to this morning's arraignment and now has a better idea of what kind of time her mom faces and that it is very unlikely that she will be getting out before my 18yo 25th birthday if she is convicted.
Apparently, my ex wife already has one class C felony on her record. And 3 or 4 misdemeanor drugs and alcohol related charges which were all sentenced for rehab/treatment that she never did.

Anyway, my brain is putty. I am going to go eat something and then sleep for about 12 hours. 

Yug

hang in there.  it will work out as long as you are not an alien or a weirdo.

:-/

Quote from: ducatiz on March 04, 2013, 04:35:31 PM
Yug

hang in there.  it will work out as long as you are not an alien or a weirdo.

:-/

One out of two isn't bad. ;)

What an absolute nightmare this whole situation must be for you. Good luck, Zltful.

Holy bat-balls!

Good luck!  You shouldn't need it, but I'll wish it anyway.

Quote from: ducatiz on March 04, 2013, 04:35:31 PM
Yug

hang in there.  it will work out as long as you are not an alien or a weirdo.

:-/

Time to hide the spaceship.

I'll just hide it in Uranus.  [laugh]


Anyway, my 18yo is now at her Grandma's house. (Ex's mom).
They are going back down for a jail visit on Sunday then my 18yo is going to be moving in with my dad. We just don't have the space on such short notice but depending on how things go and where she gets a job, she will most likely stay there for a while. She has agreed to help pay for expenses and a small amount for rent.

My youngest...I think what is going to happen there is I will sue for full custody/removal of her mother's parental rights.
Once that is done, my youngest will most likely is going to stay down there to finish out at least this school year and we will play it by ear from there.
I told her that she needs to be where she will feel like she has the best chance to succeed and that I won't force her to do anything she doesn't want to do.

Ultimately, I have a strong feeling that she will end up with us.

So some updates...

My 18yo moved up here. She is living at my dad's house but has also been given the option of a posession charge back home in Missouri and some jail time (they all it "shock") or she can get a drug abuse evaluation and follow their recommendation to the letter.
She is at the eval as I type this.
She needs to get her shit together because hanging out at the park across the street from my dad's house all day instead of hopping the bus and hitting up places to apply to like she said she was going to do but didn't...not gonna fly very long.
I want to be there for her but I can't sit by and let her turn into a full scale replica of her mother.

My 15yo was suspended from school for being late too many time in the last couple of weeks.
The state has begun evaluating her current household's status as a foster care provider because she also tested positive to marijuana...and she also was bragging on Facebook about how she beat the first test by dipping the cup in the toilet water.
So the case worker called me and said that she may have no choice but to move her out of that house. I am fully for it as I suspect that she is smoking weed with the caregiver's daughter (19yo drop out lives at home...self proclaimed "witch"...).

The custody request has been passed on to the state folks in Jefferson City, MO. Those folks will send it to Iowa to get that ball rollin' along.
Still a whole lot of waiting...

Wow...

So your little one was clean, right up until she was taken away from the nutjob ex.
Screwed up world, I tell you.

I can't even begin to give you advice on the older one, as she's at the age where she will do whatever she can think up, and only she can give or not give a crap about what the choices do to her and everyone around her.

Good luck to you, and to your kids.

BC.

Man, I hope the older one keeps her head on straight. Such a bad age to go haywire....  :-\

Quote from: Speedbag on March 18, 2013, 04:42:12 PM
Man, I hope the older one keeps her head on straight. Such a bad age to go haywire....  :-\

Agreed.  No damn good.

 [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang] [bang]

So I spent most of yesterday trying to get a hold of my 18yo.
Needed some contact info from her because the state of Missouri feels that the home that my youngest is currently in isn't good for her (Gee...ya think? I mean she was only suspended yesterday for being late to school EVERY make the beast with two backsING DAY SINCE SHE WAS PLACED THERE). There are rumors that the caregiver's 19yo daughter is providing my youngest with marijuana and the mom isn't doing anything to stop it. The caseworker did a mouth swab drug test on her but admitted that a UA was much more accurate. But the only tech that was available for the test was a male and obvious a male can't go into the bathroom with her.

The reason I couldn't find my 18yo is because she spent the day with some 27yo guy she met on an online dating site 2 days ago and ended up spending the entire day and all night last night with him.
Unfortunately for her, I had "Find Friends" installed on her phone when she first got up here so I already know pretty much everything about this guy.
She seemed rather surprised when I texted her this morning with "So...how are you and Alin doing this morning..."
She actually replied to that asking how I knew who she was with. She was even more surprised when I texted her his full name, address, DoB, SS#, what make model and year car he drives, who he has his auto insurance through (liability only), his parents' names and addresses (they were divorced in 98...).
Don't try to pull shit over on the guy with the former CIA analyst for a wife. She has "resources".

Anyway, she is supposed to be going to get signed up for treatment this morning. She was supposed to be there by 8 but called and told my brother's fiance not to pick her up until 10 so she has a chance to get to my dad's house and change.

I think I freaked her out pretty good but SERIOUSLY don't think she is taking any of this serious. I am on the verge of just stepping back and letting that whole trainwreck unfold and then being there when she actually does hit rock bottom to give her a hand back up. I seriously think that she needs a HUGE reality check.

Before anyone else gets their panties in a bunch, it isn't like we called the new director of the CIA (my wife worked with him when he was an analyst) for information on this guy.

We both used resources available to the general public that involve no level of government clearance. No laws were broken, bent, twisted, molested, scalded, waterboarded or otherwise violated to obtain the information on this guy.
Every piece of information is available publically if you just know where to look. Granted, the SS# was a bit of a surprise but he was first issued his license before Iowa switched away from SS#s being the same as your license #.

QuoteBefore anyone else gets their panties in a bunch, it isn't like we called the new director of the CIA (my wife worked with him when he was an analyst) for information on this guy.

We both used resources available to the general public that involve no level of government clearance. No laws were broken, bent, twisted, molested, scalded, waterboarded or otherwise violated to obtain the information on this guy.
Every piece of information is available publically if you just know where to look. Granted, the SS# was a bit of a surprise but he was first issued his license before Iowa switched away from SS#s being the same as your license #.

ya gotta do whatcha gotta do [evil]

man! the amplitude of raw suckage in your life is considerable

little did you realize at the time, that while you were on a parental "vacation" of sorts

a shit storm of this intensity was brewing

sorry you are paying such a high interest on a prior bad marital investment

the kids do pay for the sins of the parents and your ex has done a banner job make the beast with two backsing them over

may she burn in hell for putting her personal baggage ahead of her children's welfare and well-being

18yo:
Dropped her third dirty UA in as many weeks.
Claims she isn't using and that "shit stays in your body!"
Problem with her logic is that her first UA was dirty meth and amphetamines...second was weed third was amphetamines only.
Has spent the last 3 nights with the guy she met on the internet.
Claims that she is doing what she needs to do to get better.
Keeps telling everyone what they want to hear but isn't actually acting on it.
Has missed 3 intake appointments for rehab now.
The rehab place has said, 3 strikes, you're out. They won't even consider her now. This is the place my sister in law did her internship and is doing her graduate work at. She can't even pull any more strings than she already has.

I have dropped roughly $1k on rent, expenses, food and transportation on her. I have also been keeping her on my medical dental and vision insurance.
She says that I am not doing anything for her and that I have no right to be in her life now when I was never there for her before.

I don't want to through monetary support in her face. Nor do I want to lower myself to the spiteful name calling and hurtful level she has taken on. She reminds me a lot of her mother.
I am seriously beginning to consider pulling all support and letting her see the shit storm she would be facing without everything that her family has done for her.


Apparently, she stole and pawned a bunch of items that were in her mom's house.
She claims to know nothing about it but the inventory of the house by the detectives working the case is coming up short by about 2 dozen items.
About half were recovered from a pawn shop down there.
The sheriff's dept is currently working with the county prosecutor to see what, if any charges should be pressed.

I am on the verge of hypertension and I have never had a single blood pressure issue in my life.

I don't want to give up on her but I feel like I am dealing with her mom all over again.


The youngest has been removed from the house she was in. Fortunately, her pastor stepped up since she still can't leave the state. She has said that if she can't live at the house she was in then she would rather live with us. Not much I can do there until the process plays out. But at least she has a roof over her head.

Somehow, I feel that most of this is my fault. If I had been a better father. Had fought harder for them and not let their mother drag them down this shit covered path. My 18yo cries, "I want my mom! She's the only one who truly understands and supports me!" And it both hurts and angers me. I resist the temptation to throw all of that back in her face about how if her mom really cared, she would have thought about the consequences.

But I strive to be the better person in all of this and simply be there. Throughout the outbursts and the claims of not caring. I will be there. And high blood pressure and hyper tension be damned.

breathe brother...breathe!....keep your calm and your wits about you and 1 day, ( maybe not tommorrow or any day really soon) she'll come down to earth and reality and to terms with everything and you'll look and be that much better in her eyes for being the same person of respect, dignity, and reliable strength for which she will come to the sense of understanding of....emotions run hot and cold, especially with the additive haze of external substance affecting her...

don't let the what-ifs get a strangle hold on you.....you're doing great!

keep the dialog open and positive with her, she'll come around you'll see.
put on your sneakers and go for a long jog, you'll feel better.

QuoteI feel like Rat...or Piller...

You're a Pillar dude!

You're doing the right thing, man. Eventually she will see the light that you are the 'right' parent, and hopefully it won't take too long. But, unfortunately, sometimes it does in these cases.....

Worst case: ride up again sometime and we'll have a beer.  [beer]

Keep posting please - I learn more about human nature from this.
One thing is certain. You're a good guy.

Support!

I say go for a court-ordered Lock-Down Rehab for the 18 year old.

If they can leverage property theft to get a judge to slam a gavel on rehab go for it

You aren't dealing with a rational human,,,, you are dealing with an Addiction

trust me, the Addiction has far more time and energy than you do and you are not going to "hug it" ,,chase it,, or "buy it" back to healthy

I hope you get this daughter back to the world of the living, but right now whatever you think she is, or remember she was...she ain't really there anymore...

it is an addiction demon leveraging the vestiges of a once-viable personality to manipulate people so it can continue to feast on your daughter

sorry she has washed out to sea, as for life lines.......

she needs all her choices removed and a forced long term dry-out/therapeutic community if she is to stand a chance

not easy to clinically detach from a child, or loved family member but if you can,,, it makes you more effective in out-flanking the demon in her


you also need to learn to do what you are doing not in the expectation of an outcome....but to do the right things for your own sake, and then hers

what you do defines the measure of you as a human,,,,,,, you cannot fix her, only she can,,, under the right circumstances with the right help

but you can do the right things, so that you can look yourself in the mirror

no matter what the outcome

I have been on your road with too many family members..... fortunately not with any of my children

Quote from: RAT900 on March 22, 2013, 10:49:12 PM
I say go for a court-ordered Lock-Down Rehab for the 18 year old.

If they can leverage property theft to get a judge to slam a gavel on rehab go for it

You aren't dealing with a rational human,,,, you are dealing with an Addiction

trust me, the Addiction has far more time and energy than you do and you are not going to "hug it" ,,chase it,, or "buy it" back to healthy

I hope you get this daughter back to the world of the living, but right now whatever you think she is, or remember she was...she ain't really there anymore...

it is an addiction demon leveraging the vestiges of a once-viable personality to manipulate people so it can continue to feast on your daughter

sorry she has washed out to sea, as for life lines.......

she needs all her choices removed and a forced long term dry-out/therapeutic community if she is to stand a chance

not easy to clinically detach from a child, or loved family member but if you can,,, it makes you more effective in out-flanking the demon in her


you also need to learn to do what you are doing not in the expectation of an outcome....but to do the right things for your own sake, and then hers

what you do defines the measure of you as a human,,,,,,, you cannot fix her, only she can,,, under the right circumstances with the right help

but you can do the right things, so that you can look yourself in the mirror

no matter what the outcome

I have been on your road with too many family members..... fortunately not with any of my children

You need to keep that foremost in your mind. You also need to remember that you did not break her. It wasn't your ability or caring as a parent, or lack of it.

She chose a path and now needs to alter it. It is her choice as to whether she allows you to help.

There is no possibility of failure on your part in this.

Learned some new words last night...

"Autonomic Dysreflexia"

Most common in spinal injury patients, this can also be one of the direct symptoms of extreme hypertension.
It shows up in the form of a splotchy and sometimes hives like skin condition.
Spent a few hours after work at the hospital because I couldn't get my heart rate down and was experiencing the worst migraine of my life.

On a side note, someone told her fiance...(She is/was engaged to a guy down in Missouri who had hit rock bottom himself and is currently in rehab on his way to recovery). She of course blamed me until I pointed out that the time he said this message was sent to him coincided with me being in the hospital with a dead phone battery.

She has now alienated her grandparents, aunt and uncle.
My sister in law is still trying to save her because she faced the same demons in her life...but she is trying to detach herself because of how volatile my daughter has become.

I will say that this weekend, I am detaching myself completely from the whole situation and enjoying spending some time with my grandmother who turns 97 tomorrow. She wants to go out for Russian food tonight and for a "fine German lunch" tomorrow.

Quote from: ZILBERT on March 23, 2013, 05:31:55 AM

On a side note, someone told her fiance...(She is/was engaged to a guy down in Missouri who had hit rock bottom himself and is currently in rehab on his way to recovery). She of course blamed me until I pointed out that the time he said this message was sent to him coincided with me being in the hospital with a dead phone battery.

Are you referring to your ex-wife?

I'm lost, for the moment...

BC.

good for you.....
you can tell us about the Kasha and patato pancakes on monday!

cheers [clap]

Quote from: Bladecutter on March 23, 2013, 08:15:14 AM
Are you referring to your ex-wife?

I'm lost, for the moment...

BC.

My 18yo is "engaged" to some dude currently in rehab.

Quote from: ZILBERT on March 24, 2013, 06:59:56 PM
My 18yo is "engaged" to some dude currently in rehab.

nothing like setting your sights high....I hope you aren't planning on financing that wedding

I remember clocking my addict brother years ago...for some theft...he said why did you punch me?  I told him I didn't  punch him, I was punching his addiction

Quote from: RAT900 on March 25, 2013, 05:16:58 AM
nothing like setting your sights high....I hope you aren't planning on financing that wedding

I remember clocking my addict brother years ago...for some theft...he said why did you punch me?  I told him I didn't  punch him, I was punching his addiction

Nicely put RAT.

For what it's worth, some of mental illnesses only become apparent at around the age of your eldest daughter.  I am not a doctor, so my advice here is worth less than nothing, but an interview with a competent psychiatrist might be something to consider.  She not just making selfish choices, she's being self destructive. In any case if, you can't get help for her, get some for yourself, health issues like you have been having sound serious to me.   

This shouldn't be make the beast with two backsing dictating every aspect of my life but lately it has.


Monday was a day of hearings and depositions in Missouri proving that I am not running some drug lab out of my place too. Of course, this is all supposed to be covered when Iowa does their home study...but apparently we are doubling up our efforts.

The 18yo has convinced her grandma that she has a cold. She doesn't. She is robo-tripping. Grandma picked up a Costco sized package of cold meds for her. Pretty evident in her Facebook pics.

15yo is rebelling and grades are suffering. Judge wants me to be more active in her day to day life.
Uh...she is 3.5 hours away and we talk for an hour or more every single night not to mention texting and chatting via Facebook all the time. Aside from moving to Missouri, what else would you suggest FFS??

I have obligations both in work and personal life that have taken a back seat to all of this and I am afraid that work relationships and personal relationships are suffering because of it.
And of course, I can't tell anyone no. LOL.

[bang] [bang]

Quote from: ZILBERT on April 03, 2013, 05:04:12 PMMonday was a day of hearings and depositions in Missouri proving that I am not running some drug lab out of my place too. Of course, this is all supposed to be covered when Iowa does their home study...but apparently we are doubling up our efforts.

15yo is rebelling and grades are suffering. Judge wants me to be more active in her day to day life.
Uh...she is 3.5 hours away and we talk for an hour or more every single night not to mention texting and chatting via Facebook all the time.
Aside from moving to Missouri, what else would you suggest FFS??

I have obligations both in work and personal life that have taken a back seat to all of this and I am afraid that work relationships and personal relationships are suffering because of it.
And of course, I can't tell anyone no. LOL.

[bang] [bang]

I'll ignore the whole 18 year old daughter thing, because, honestly, she's an adult, and has the right to f her life up to her desire, and you have no legal recourse at all.

As for the judge, you just simply say:

"My ex-wife took my daughter out of State, against court orders, several years ago, and I was not allowed to see her by the ex-wife.
If you grant me custody of my daughter, I will bring her back home to our State, and I will be in her life, every day, for the rest of her life.
Is that acceptable to you, your honor?"

That should pretty much end any statements that the judge can make against you.

BC.

Quote from: ZILBERT on April 03, 2013, 05:04:12 PM
I have obligations both in work and personal life that have taken a back seat to all of this and I am afraid that work relationships and personal relationships are suffering because of it.
And of course, I can't tell anyone no. LOL.
[bang] [bang]

Heal up the family.  All will align in good time.  You are doing amazing things.  Love ya buddy. [drink]

I can offer nothing but moral support -- your 18yo sounds like she has a lot farther to go before hitting bottom and she doesn't seem to be trying to go up. 

You still have some time with your 15yo, but the state is making it hard for you to parent by keeping her away from you. 

I'm sorry man. 

Updates...

Well my 18yo has been doing her treatment.
Actually started going to AA meetings alongside voluntarily.
I am not naive enough to believe that things will miraculously get better.
The problem signs are still there as she is still glorifying her mother (who has been released from jail and is currently on house arrest pending trial...more on that in a second) on Facebook and how much her mother is her "rock". No pun intended.
She wants me to go to the Family day with her on Thursday. At first I was even somewhat flattered until she added, "I mean since mom can't go and you're the only family I have up here..." Let's ignore the grandparents that gave you a free place to stay while you get your shit together...or the other grandparents that are providing monetary support to keep you fed...or the countless relatives that are chauffuering you around...
It's like she has no sight outside of the tunnel vision she has for her mother.
I think the lack of appreciation for the family that has actually been there for her is pissing me off more than anything else.

My youngest and I are going to take a weekend camping trip to the Ozarks once the weather has settled a bit more. And we are most likely going to spend a weekend with her in KC or STL in the next couple of weekends.
We text back and forth basically daily and talk on the phone every couple of nights after school.
The school reports that hr grades are indeed recovering a bit but she is still having moments when she just doesn't seem to give a crap.
She is going to a counselor twice a week and so far, that has been positive.

And now the mother...
She has been released and put on house arrest pending trial. Not so much a big deal until you consider where she is staying.
She is staying with her father who has 5 OWIs, 2 domestic assaults and was kicked out of AA for showing up drunk all the time. He also has several Disturbing The Peace convictions from his drunken antics.
He has drug problems as well. And lets not forget that he resides in a different state.
I can't see many positives coming out of this.
But apparently, Missouri says that "jail was not a suitable environment for her continued mental health."
No shit?

Anyway, things have quieted down a touch but the mom is still the biggest caustic part of this whole situation and she is already trying to figure out ways of seeing my youngest without state supervised visitations.
I worry that I will end up with one of those "Mother Kidnaps Daughter" headlines.

You continue to be in my thoughts...  Hope all this works out man.

As the next hearing approaches, I thought that I should give an update.

Not having RAT here anymore makes posting the continued baby mama drama feel somewhat futile but I really need to share it somewhere...with someone...lest I pop.

Let's start with the ex wife.
Her accomplice changed his plea to guilty and was sentenced to 6 years in prison...but it was a suspended sentence pending completion of a 120 day "shock incarceration" program. They also dropped all except 2 felony charges against him so he was only charged with felony possession and felony manufacture. The felony child endangerment and misdemeanor charges were dropped. This was also his first offense. He has no other record at all so the sentence seems to fit...even if I don't agree with it.

My ex wife reached a plea agreement, the details of which are unknown but from what I can tell, her felony child endangerment charge was dropped. She is still charged with felony possession, felony manufacture and misdemeanor paraphenelia charges. Her sentencing hearing is July 2nd.

In the meantime, she went to visit her other 2 kids from her second marriage. At that visitation, apparently, the kids were yelling at her to leave, that they didn’t love her anymore and that they never wanted to see her again. Following that visit, she had a visitation with my youngest daughter. All of her visitations with the minor children have to be state supervised.

Charlea said that at her visit, she was detached and didn’t really say much but kept telling her not to make the same mistakes she did and that she loved her over and over again.

After the visit, she went back to her dad’s house and shortly after midnight that night left the house and didn’t tell anyone where she was going. The next day around noon, she was found in the town’s park at the baseball field, passed out and unresponsive in a pool of vomit. She had urinated and deficated herself and her vitals were critically low.

She was taken to a local hospital and then transported to a university hospital about 2 hours away. She eventually came out of it and when questioned, she had ODed on meth along with her father’s sleeping pills and drank a bottle of vodka. She was attempting to kill herself.

Once she was back to health a bit more, she was transferred to a psychiatric facility. Apparently, no new charges or release agreement violations are being considered and she was recently released and returned to her dad’s house.


My 18yo had been staying with my parents but she disappeared for several weeks. Turns out, she had spent 2 weeks with some guy up here and then went and was hanging out with her mom. She wasn’t answering texts or phone calls from anyone. When we were finally able to get a hold of her, she relayed the above information to us. She then said she was “scared for her rock…her mommy…” and that she was going to stay down there to try and help get her mom better. Come to find out, the real reason she wanted to stay down there was because her “fiance” was out of his treatment incarceration on a week long furlough.

So he goes back, her mom is in the psych ward and now she wants to come back and live with my parents again. I told her flat out that this was it. This was her last chance and if she make the beast with two backsed up again, I was washing my hands of it all and she was going to truly be on her own as my family and her mom’s rational side of the family would follow suit. She promised that she was going to get her shit together and find a job (supposedly she had an interview lined up with Lady Footlocker but it turned out she lied about that too).

But alas…last Saturday I get a text from my 18yo that she wants to talk to me. I ask her what is up and suddenly she is all cryptic about only wanting to talk in person. So I tell her that I am out running errands so it will be at least 2 hours before I can get over there. She then says that she will be at the ER then so I should meet her there.

Well, I have frozen stuff in the trunk and it was in the 90s so I head for home to unload the groceries and my wife says, “I bet she’s pregnant…” So I text my 18yo back and ask her if she is pregnant. She replies with, “Maybe not anymore.” Tasks taken care of, I head for the hospital and get directed to her room in the ER.

I don’t say much while we wait for the Dr. When the Dr gets into the room, he asks her a battery of questions including, “Psotive pregnancy test?” To which she replies that she has taken 5 pee tests and 4 of them were positive with the fifth being a “faint positive”. The Dr then informs her that if that’s the case, then she is definitely pregnant. To be sure though, he orders another pee test along with bloodwork to determine how far along she is.

Let’s back up a bit here…4 weeks before this she was with her fiance for 1 week. Other than that, they haven’t seen each other in over 4 months. My wife wonders if her fiance knows about math. Make note of this as I continue.

So the Dr comes back and says that she was indeed pregnant…~6-8 weeks along. But that she is also having a miscarriage. Unfortunate, to be sure. But a damned relief. The Dr says that aside from getting more rest, there is nothing that she needs to do and nothing more that can be done. So she begins to get dressed and calls her mom (who at this time is still in the mental ward but can receive phone calls from family). While she is on the phone with her mom, she puts the phone on speaker and sets it down to get dressed. Her mom’s sage advice at this time of (sarcasm) woe…”Oh baby…I am so sorry. I guess you will just have to keep on trying.” WTF?!? Who even says that to their unemployed, virtually homeless 18yo daughter??!

As an aside, a couple of weeks before this, my wife texted my 18yo to inform her that, according to her insurance explanation of benefits, she was starting to accrue some medical bills. I had kept her on my insurance in hopes that she would have coverage but fully expecting her to pay her own co-pays. Anyway, my daughter texts me and says to tell Robin to leave her alone and that her mom was helping her get on title 19. I explained to her that this was all well and good but that she would still be responsible for her previously accrued medical bills up until the point where she was approved for title 19. I also explained that having her on my insurance and on title 19, the government would only grant her supplemental title 19 insurance and not full coverage due to her already having insurance. So she tells me to take her off my insurance so that title 19 will cover it all. She also says, “And don’t worry about those bills…I will just file bankruptcy like mom did.” *FACEPALM*

So I am driving her home from the hospital and I am not saying much because I am livid and don’t want to regret saying anything. We get to my parents’ house and before she gets out I ask her, “Rachel…how the make the beast with two backs do you expect to take care of a baby when you can’t even take care of yourself?”. She just mumbles “I dunno…” and gets out of the car.

Monday rolls around and I get a call from her telling me that she finally has a plan for her life. She is filling out the paperwork for Job Corps and she meets with her recruiter on Friday to find out when she has to report to the Job Corps center. That’s great…all well and good. But she has already quit Job Corps twice in the past since dropping out of high school. But she swears up and down that this time will be different and she will finish Job Corps and when she gets her GED through them, she is going to join the Air Force.

If history holds true to form, she will make it a few weeks before wanting to come home again. I am pretty much done though. She needs to fix herself and I am done trying.


Now on to my 15yo.
Overall, she has been doing well enough. She did have to do summer school for 3 classes (history, algebra 2 and social studies) because even though she scored high on the end of term evals, her grades had dropped too low to receiving passing even with the good test scores.

So she took summer school. She passed with flying colors and she is stoked to get the hell out of foster care. Unfortunately, the state of Missouri is still dragging its feet “in hopes of returning the child to the parent’s home from whom she was removed.”

I had a very animated conversation with the case worker today about how asinine it is to try to get her back with her mother when her mother is attempting suicide, still hasn’t been sentenced and is just generally a bad idea.

They moved my 15yo to yet another foster home (that’s 3 since this shit began) because apparently, the mother and daughter she was living with were having major issues between themselves and the caregiver asked to have her relocated.

Seems to my logical mind that the best thing for her would be to get her into my custody and into a stable environment instead of prolonging the stressful living arrangements and anquish of hope that they are going to place her back with her mother when everyone involved knows it isn’t going to happen.

So I am going down to Missouri this weekend and we are going to go find some stuff to explore. On Monday, I am requesting that the judge let her come up to my house for the holiday week. I am also hoping that we will have new info on a timeline so that I can get her enrolled in school for the 2013-2014 school year.

But that’s where we are at. This situation consumes the vast majority of my time. It has cancelled pretty much any possible chance of a summer vacation for my wife and I. And it has caused stress throughout the family on both sides. Sadly, my ex-wife appears to have no remorse and is *only* concerned with how this will effect her. At our last family status call, all she would talk about was how she was afraid that I would never let her see her daughter. It was like she wasn’t even aware that *she* caused all of this.

So there we are. And I think my goatee is just a little bit more grey.

I hate to ask, but if the ex-wife does manage to kill herself, what happens to your youngest?
Does she then get put into your custody, or does she forever go into foster care until she is 18?

I think you need to ask the judge that question when the next hearing occurs.

BC.

jeebus man.

you are a rock for staying sane thru all that.

Man, your plate is full.

I am all for reduced sentences for first time offenders, and our drug policy does need reform. But, it seems to me that the child endangerment, and a possibility of a lab explosion(as well as all the violence that the meth world brings) is the bigger issue. I don't give a crap if an ADULT wants to screw up their own life, but when it comes to innocents, particularly teenage dependants, I think that should be taken more seriously. I mean what is the real issue? The child endangerment, to ME at least, is the bigger crime. Yet that charge was dropped.

I really hope you get custody of your youngest, seems to me that should be a no brainer.

Totally agree that, man, you need a vacation. Even if it is just seeing your daughter over the holiday. You must be able to maintain your own livelyhood through this.

Best hopes for you and your family.

Quote from: Bladecutter on June 28, 2013, 10:25:28 AM
I hate to ask, but if the ex-wife does manage to kill herself, what happens to your youngest?
Does she then get put into your custody, or does she forever go into foster care until she is 18?

I think you need to ask the judge that question when the next hearing occurs.

BC.

That question has been asked. Unfortunately, Missouri's policy is to do everything they can, within the confines of the law and with full consideration to the safety of the child to place the child back with the parent they were removed from. Barring that, her death would mean that is no longer an option and placement with me would be certain.

But to add to that, I have to wait until this all plays out before I can petition the courts in Iowa to receive full custodial guardianship of my 15yo.

WOW!

judicial ass hattery like you describe is why people go postal.

Marine Corps for the 18yo

Quote from: duccarlos on June 28, 2013, 02:10:44 PM
Marine Corps for the 18yo

+1

I had been thinking some military service would straighten her ass out pronto also.....

Jeez dude, I feel for ya.  :-\

just read through this entire thread and it's left me speechless! I really feel for you man and hope everything works out with time!

Quote from: The Mad King Pepe' on June 28, 2013, 03:48:20 PM
just read through this entire thread and it's left me speechless! I really feel for you man and hope everything works out with time!

Same here. I'm floored.
Good luck & don't forget to take care of yourself. 

Having to share a house with my wife`s 30 year old ADDICTED son I have the greatest respect for you, I have given up on him and am in the process of removing myself and my own son from this negative input to my life.

STAY STRONG  [thumbsup]

The one major positive that came out of the last hearing (Monday) was that once the paperwork from Iowa is received, we won't need another hearing and I can immediately take custody of my 15yo.
Once I do that and get her moved back up to my place, we are going to petition the Iowa courts to revoke my ex-wife's parental rights. My daughter wants this as well but still wants to see her when/if she gets her shit together.

I am trying to get Iowa child support stopped because it is still going to the mother instead of the foster care provider as I was originally led to believe. But after spending 1 hour on hold this morning and sitting now on hold for the last 1 hr and 15 mins, I am considering just driving out there. They are only about 5 miles away from my work.

Anyway, everyone seems to be impressed by how well I am taking this. But I have my moments. Fortunately, owning a motorcycle affords me some good blow off time.

You're an incredible dad, they are very lucky to have someone like you.
Keep fighting the good fight.

Fight the Good Fight by Triumph (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PigupJKlOk#)

Quote from: duccarlos on June 28, 2013, 02:10:44 PM
Marine Corps for the 18yo

Why would the Marine Corps, or any other branch of the armed forces, want to sort out the "life issues" of the 18yo?

Quote from: krolik on July 03, 2013, 03:13:36 PMWhy would the Marine Corps, or any other branch of the armed forces, want to sort out the "life issues" of the 18yo?

Unfortunately, I feel the same way.

The Marine Corps helped get my brother back on track.

The problem is, Carlos, your brother probably wanted that. My 18yo wants nothing more than to hang out with her friends, smoke dope and to bang her BF.
She doesn't want to work. She doesn't want to contribute.
The last conversation my wife had with her went something like this:
Wife: You should work on taking care of those medical bills you are building up.
Daughter: Nah...I have dad's insurance. Besides, mom is helping me get on title 19.
Wife: Well that is all well and good but 1. Insurance doesn't pay the full amount and 2. Title 19 doesn't cover bills you have already accrued.
Daughter: That's OK. I will just file for bankruptcy like mom did.

Hard to motivation that much lack of motivation. She saw her mom living for years on other peoples' money so she thinks that she can do the same and all it takes is getting pregnant.

My other brother, not the Marine, had a long time GF like that. They had a kid together so she got away with trying to kill him a few times, she's a psycho. Anyway, while he was no saint, they both lived off what he "earned" selling dope and whatever she could get out of the government. She attempted some jobs and she was actually a beauty school dropout, she got kicked out for getting into fights.

At one point we managed to get my brother out and moved him with us in alone. We were able to reprogram him for about 6 months. We replaced a lot of the bad with a job from a guy that came to think of him as a son and the violent shit with hunting. Then, she shows up with his kid and the 2 others she had before she met him. I move out of state and he has to move into various different places. Wherever they end up they destroy the place. She goes to jail a few times for trying to stab him and finally he leaves her at a group home and takes custody of their kid.

I will not go into detail on how this person ruined a whole bunch of relationships within my family, but she was a wrecking ball and after years I'm still trying to mend some relationships. I'm not saying you should give up on your daughter, but at this point she's already pretty messed up. Don't take your family down with your attempts to educate her. Reprogramming a person takes a huge amount of dedication, not only from you, but also from everyone around her. Not everyone will be willing to put as much into her turning her life around. If you're truly dedicated, bring her into your house, get her a job, you drive her to work every day, make sure that her boss is with you to keep an eye on her during the day. The best results are if she's too busy to even consider doing anything else. Her job does have to be rewarding and leading to something. My wife and I were lucky to have found that one guy that was willing to sacrifice to help out.

18yo told me to eff off and die tonight. Said she never wants to see or talk to me again.
I told her fine. It's all good. Good luck with your life. And goodbye.

Then she promptly had her friend drive her to my 15yo's foster home and convinced her to "come hang out with us". They took off in her friends car. They found then. Sheriff was going to arrest my 18yo but apparently she had a major anxiety attack and ended up in the ER.

My 15yo is back with her foster care provider.
But now I get to call the juvenile court officer tomorrow and tell them that I do not want my 18yo to have visitation at all without state supervision.

The 18yo can't seem to understand that now, not only is she trying to make the beast with two backs up her own life but that of her 15yo sister.

She also had her friends gang up on my wife and my 20yo daughter on Facebook and even went so far as accusing me of being a pedophile because I posted up a picture of my at age 8 in my underwear with my nephew.

Ended up reporting and blocking all of the friends but now my 15yo is pissed at me because *I* am causing her stress.

[bang]

Did you rob from the poor in a past life dude?!  This is like watching the first 90 minutes of Groundhog Day.  Just when you thought "what else could go wrong"?!  Now the introduction of the "p" word. 

:-X

 :P

Quote from: IZ on July 11, 2013, 02:06:15 AM
Did you rob from the poor in a past life dude?!  This is like watching the first 90 minutes of Groundhog Day.  Just when you thought "what else could go wrong"?!  Now the introduction of the "p" word. 

Had a conversation with a friend today...I said I feel like an episode of Jerry Springer.
"Nope...this stuff is too messed up for Springer."

Quote from: ZILBERT on July 11, 2013, 10:03:24 AM
Had a conversation with a friend today...I said I feel like an episode of Jerry Springer.
"Nope...this stuff is too messed up for Springer."

More like Breaking Bad. I feel for you man. Don't you wish the 18yo would just get a Godsmack?

Quote from: LowThudd on July 11, 2013, 10:49:36 AM
More like Breaking Bad. I feel for you man. Don't you wish the 18yo would just get a Godsmack?

Well I have a strong feeling that the local sheriff in the town she "moved" back to (I use quotes because she is apparently bouncing from friend's house to friend's house with the occasional stop in at the ER to attempt to get some prescription pain killers.) still has a hard on to get her arrested. And from what I can tell, she isn't far from it.

The funny part is she texted me today telling me that I needed to start treating her like I would any other adult.
So I told her, Fine...lose my number and stop trying to get me to feel pity for you...exactly what I would tell any other adult who continuously shit on me and mine.

If the Sherriff wanted to arrest her, the fake ER run wouldn't have stopped them.

Holy shit brother. Get your 15 year old the hell out of there. At least you can salvage one.

Agreed ^ but it sounds like her only chance is if older sister gets locked up for a long time in another state.  ???

Quote from: IZ on July 11, 2013, 08:34:56 PM
Agreed ^ but it sounds like her only chance is if older sister gets locked up for a long time in another state.  ???

He can get a restraining order against the older sister. And then watch the 15 year old like a hawk.

There's your next move then Z.

Would the 18 y/o even care or abide by that though? 

Quote from: IZ on July 12, 2013, 08:28:59 AM
There's your next move then Z.

Would the 18 y/o even care or abide by that though? 

Likely not, but without a restraining order law enforcement could do nothing when he complains she won't stay away. With it they can take her to jail.

The key is still getting her up here.

Apparently, the case worker is on vacation for another week and the documentation from Iowa is sitting on someone's desk down in Jefferson City. Until that moves, we still have to wait.
The foster care provider wasn't aware that my 18yo was not allowed unsupervised visitation...she is now.

Once the 15yo is up here, it will be easy to keep the 18yo with no license and no money away...especially since she burned bridges with all the people willing to transpost her this far.

Do you think mom told older sister to grab younger sister, and split town?

BC.

Doubt it. My 15yo is back with the foster family.
If the mom breaks any of the conditions of her release, they will revoke her release and will dump the plea agreement.

Paperwork cleared for me to take custody of my 15yo.
Met with an attorney at lunch today to get the ball rolling on having the mother's parental rights revoked.

And apparently, the mother was using both kids as a proxy to communicate with her current husband who she is supposed to have no contact with. The 15yo is being punished by having her cell service suspended for 2 weeks.
Time to start making her recognize the concept of consequences.

The good news, this will put the 15yo out of reach of the sister and the mother as neither has reliable transportation and issues of their own.

One, or more, of the them will be grateful for your effort - at some point. So will you  [thumbsup]

I'm impressed!

That's terrific! At least you will be able to communicate and take care of her. Show her how a real parent behaves. [thumbsup]

Finally, a positive!!  :)

here and now would be a great placement for 'Tini's pom-poms

[thumbsup]

A little hiccup (and hilarity ensued).

So she most likely won't be up here this weekend.
Apparently, the judge has to either convene another hearing or the state has to submit a motion to place her with me even though the paperwork is approved.
Judge said send it over, I will review it and get the motion signed.

Ex-wife was on the conference call and said that she isn't comfortable with the 15yo being with me (she had been sniffling and crying the whole conference call and now is on full on bawling and can't understand her mode.) All of this triggered by my 15yo no commital daughter doing a typical teenaged phone *shrug* and "I guess so."
The ex-wife took that to mean that she wasn't wanting to move up with me. When in reality she was all like whatever and stuff ya know.

Then the ex wife asks to have the placement put on hold until after her sentencing hearing next month.
The case worker steps in at this point and says, "Yeah...let's discuss that right here and now Jenny. First, the state's primary focus is to place the child with a parent. In this case, the non-offending parent who doesn't have a sentencing hearing and the potential of 6 years in prison looming. Even if you were to only get probation, the state would still not recommend placement until you had completed your drug treatment, full term of your supervised probation and any psychiatric evalutation the court ordered. What I am getting at is, for your daughter's sake and stability, the state feels it is best for the placement to be with the father."

The ex-wife is blubbering by this point.
So the guardian ad-litum(spl?) steps in and says that nobody wants to keep her from seeing her daughter but that at this point in time, she needs to focus on her stuff and let her daughter focus on living a stable life. She also said that she needed to stop putting herself first and cut the pity party so that we can focus on the child who is suffering the most. (I had to mute my phone because I was pretty openly laughing at this point).

So we continue on and ultimately it is decided to hold off until tomorrow to finalize the placement motion with the judge so that the ex-wife can have her scheduled visitation and they can address any concerns she has at that time.
My only contribution was concern that we get this squared away as quickly as possible so that we can get her settled before the school year starts and we still need to get her enrolled.

The other thing that was discussed was visitation with the mother. She wanted me to come down to her place (2.5 hour drive one way) every week and that she preferred Wednesdays or Thursdays. I pointed out that first of all, doing it mid week is a no go as both me and my wife work full time M-F jobs and it would be unfair to force *us* to work around *her* schedule being that she was currently unemployed. So visitation was moved to the weekend. The other concern was that she is renting an apartment from her dad and as such, going to her place wouldn’t be a good idea as her dad has been openly hostile towards me and has threatened me multiple times in the past. I said that I wasn’t sure I was fully comfortable with that and that it was also unfair to insist that I have to travel the full distance when as it was now, she was going to the visitations at a state office 2 hours away.
We didn’t really end up with a resolution but by this time, the call was winding down. So we ended the call.

The case worker called me up and said that she was sorry for not jumping in but that she agreed with me. She said that visitation should be held in a place of my choosing, not the ex-wife’s and should revolve around my schedule. Not hers.
So we still need to get that finalized but the case worker is going to tell her to pound sand if she doesn’t want to meet me somewhere near my place.
There is also the permanent custody thing but my lawyer got that ball rolling yesterday.

So now we wait a little bit more. Tomorrow’s visit is going to be my ex-wife trying to talk my 15yo out of leaving foster care. And, of course, generally trying to manipulate my 15yo.
Funny that she has recently had to take a parenting class…

friggen in-san-i-ty! 

She's really telling you which days work better for her..and..in the middle of the week?!

[roll]

I hope that judge is laughing at that request too!

So I was over at my parent's house today packing up my 18yo's stuff and putting it in the garage. Also changing the locks since she refuses to return the key.
But the worst part is we found evidence that she was cooking something while she was there and I am not talking Chef Boyardee.  >:(

I called her to tell her that she would have to give notice before she came to pick up her shit otherwise she wouldn't be able to get in without breaking in.
She went all ex-wife on me.

The highlights:
She has 5 months to live.
Doctors say she has slightly elevated white cell count. (I replied, "Got a cold huh?")
She says that if I try to prevent her from seeing my 15yo, she is going to do everything she can to see her because she is willing to risk her life to see her face.
She tried blaming my sister in law for the vials and jars in her bedroom at my parent's. The same sister in law who hasn't lived there in over 2 years and who is currently a jail drug counselor at the local county lock-up.
She called my wife a c*nt and a pregnant dog. My wife wasn't even involved in the conversation and hasn't spoke to my 18yo in months.
She threatened to kidnap my 15yo if I kept her from her.
She also told me that I was the reason she wanted to die.

Granted, I may have pushed some buttons..."drama queen" and "grow up kid" were rather common sentiments that I expressed. I got a little bit immature after she started calling my wife names. She called me names too but that's different.

So notified the case worker in Missouri about what happened. Put all the text in an email to her. She has informed the foster care provider that if the 18yo shows up, she is to call the police because as of Friday, the judge has ordered the mother and the sister can ONLY have state supervised visitation and both must pass UAs before the visit. And the 18yo cannot be alone with the 15yo.

After she said she was done with me and never wanted to talk to me again, she called my brother and tried to guilt trip him into giving her money. The conversation apparently ended with her yelling, "You're just like my make the beast with two backsing dad!" My brother said thanks...that's a compliment. And then he hung up.

Up until recently, I felt bad...even had sympathy for her but she is spiraling fast and she has burned the bridges to anyone that was willing to help.
The juvenile court officer told me I need to just let it happen. That tough love will have to be my mantra and that she will have to be the one who fixes her.

Anyway, didn't want the weekend to get away without any baby-mama drama.

On a plus note, we are surprising my 15yo by re-furnishing the room that will become her bedroom. I am not showing favorites. I am trying to help the one who doesn't want to end up like her mother.

Sentencing day today for the ex-wife.
6 years with all but 120 days suspended.
Upon successful completion of 120 day shock incarceration and intensive drug treatment, she will be released on supervised probation for the remaining 6 years with any law violation equating to the full sentence being re-instated.

Basically, if she screws up, she will be in for 18 months before the possibility of parole.

18yo is pregnant doging and moaning about how unfair it is that her mommy is going to jail.  [roll]

Sounds to me like she got a slap on the wrist, considering the harm she has caused your daughters. From her behavior, I doubt he'll not eff up in the future, and will be back inside shortly. [leo] At least she is not your problem for a while.

Quote from: LowThudd on August 06, 2013, 10:42:44 AM
Sounds to me like she got a slap on the wrist

yup

[roll]

Quote from: IZ on August 06, 2013, 12:59:19 PM
yup

[roll]

+1

Quote from: ZILBERT on August 06, 2013, 10:35:44 AM
Basically, if she screws up, she will be in for 18 months before the possibility of parole.

Sadly, as seen with her sentence, they rarely follow through on this threat.

So...update time...

Latest hearing, I informed the court that I was going to pursue custodial guardianship of my daughter.
Apparently, that is the discretion of the Missouri Dept of Family Services.
Who has repeatedly told me to get custody...
But now apparently wants me to ask their permission before my attorney files anything.

Ex wife is still receiving child support.
Iowa support services finally accepted a request for a hearing to present evidence on why support should be suspended indefinitely.
October 29th...and hopefully, they will finally stop it even though my lawyer has made it clear that the state will not make it retroactive and the money paid to the incarcerated ex wife since February will be considered gone.

15yo is grounded. Night before the hearing, I went upstairs while she was in the shower and smelled cigarette smoke. Considering neither me or my wife smoke, it seemed pretty cut and dry who was doing it.
She also got out of the shower and immediately flushed the toilet...no pee...and we don't have water pressure issues so if she had used it before her shower, she could have flushed it then. Most probably flushing butts.

I didn't confront her until after the hearing on the drive back.
At which point she denied it. Then I showed her a picture of her cigarette hiding spot...asked my wife to search her room while we were gone.  She found a half a pack of cigarettes and a lighter.
Once we got home, I made her shred the cigarettes and smash the lighter. She wasn't too happy about that. Iowa tax stamp on the smokes so I know she got them since she has been up here.
Grounded her for 1 month. School, Work, home. No friends, no computer except to do homework, no phone.

That was a week ago.
Last night, she is sitting at the dining room table "doing her homework" on her computer. I am on my phone browsing Facebook and notice she is online.
I stand up and start walking towards her. She looks up and I see panic in her eyes...she closes out of her browser and says, "What's up?"
I asked her if she was on Facebook...she looks me straight in the face and lies to me and says "No..."
So I show her my phone which actually shows her time since she was last online (<5minutes ago)...
She then says, "Somebody must have hacked my account..."
I take her laptop from her and check her browser history...sure enough, she has been browsing Facebook and Twitter...and not only that, is badmouthing me to her friends on Twitter...
Posting: She says "Somebody must have hacked my account..." So I take her laptop from her and check her browser history and sure enough, instead of homework, she has been browsing Facebook and Twitter...and not only has she been on Twitter, but she is badmouthing me to her friends... "Grounded for a month? You haven't been a part of my life for 15 years and now you want to ground me? #dadsadouche"

I told her I would withhold further grounding until after our counseling appointment tonight in which I would bring all of the latest issues in front of the uninvolved third party and ask their advice before coming up with a suitable punishment.

Side note, in browsing her friends' Twitter posts, I discovered that this weekend's party at her friend, Maddie's house was a drinking party and all of her friends were bragging about how wasted/stoned/drunk they were.
Pretty sure that Maddie's house is now off limits. I don't give a flying make the beast with two backs if Maddie's parents are rich and let her do what she wants...they can afford to have grandkids from their 16 year old.  >:(

Quote from: ZILBERT on October 07, 2013, 08:38:20 AM
  I don't give a flying make the beast with two backs if Maddie's parents are rich and let her do what she wants...they can afford to have grandkids from their 16 year old.  >:(

I am pretty sure they are not rich enough to shrug off charges of contributing to the deliquency of a minor and serving alchohol to underage persons charges with the local constabulary....

Quote from: zooom on October 07, 2013, 09:22:31 AM

I am pretty sure they are not rich enough to shrug off charges of contributing to the deliquency of a minor and serving alchohol to underage persons charges with the local constabulary....

+1

Unfortunately, a stupid Iowa statute says that law enforcement has to catch the under-aged drinking in progress to fine the parents/guardian.

Quote from: ZILBERT on October 07, 2013, 12:28:09 PM
Unfortunately, a stupid Iowa statute says that law enforcement has to catch the under-aged drinking in progress to fine the parents/guardian.

monitor the twitter feed and report the next one ?!?!?

So...another day, another hearing.

This was our motion to suspend child support. Yes...I have been paying child support that the State of Iowa is sending to the incarcerated mother.
And all the court documents showing my daughter in my custody were not enough to get the state to voluntarily stop child support.

So we get to the courthouse and my attorney informs me that we have been moved to a different courtroom.
We go in, judge calls the room to order and proceeds with the reason for the hearing.
Asks my attorney for his side...asks the state for their side...

We get towards the end of it all and the judge mentions that there has been a motion entered by the petitioner (my ex-wife)...this motion is a request for continuance until she can come up to Iowa and explain why she believes that the courts should not stop her child support...very humorous...so much so that the attorney for the Child Support folks chuckles out loud a couple of times.

The judge then says, "I notice that Ms. Millhouse's (ex-wife's new name) current place of residence is the Missouri state women's correctional facility...well I guess that is ample evidence right there for me to deny the motion for continuance. Mr. Arvidson (my attorney), I see your client's request as more than fair and ask the state not to contest it. Mr. (whatever the Child support attorney's name was), do you have anything else to add?"

He says, "I would like to request that we expedite this motion to suspend. Mr. West has been paying child support in full each month since this began and I would also like to request that your honor would enter in a request from the state to refund Mr. West all support paid from August 4th to present."

I honestly wasn't expecting a dime back from this but the judge agreed and now we wait for the paperwork to trickle through the system.

Next up is my motion to the state of Missouri to grant me concurrent jurisdiction so that I can proceed with custody without having to get approval from Missouri at each step of the way. Most likely that will happen as the mother has been informed that she will be living in a half-way house for a minimum of 6 to 8 months before she is allowed to even think about getting her own place.

Progress at least.

...and they wonder why people go 'postal'. [roll]

Hang in there man. One step at a time.

 [thumbsup]

Every little victory adds up. 

[thumbsup]

+1!!!

Going about things correctly and officially are looking to work to your benefit, even though it's taking a lot of time.

JM

So another year, another hearing...this time, a permanency hearing.

Went down on the coldest day in 20 years to yet another hearing.

My ex-wife got out of prison on December 6th. She didn't try to contact my daughter until Christmas day. And then, she barely was on the phone for 5 minutes before she left.

The week before the hearing, the case worker in Missouri called me to notify me that my ex-wife was being investigated for several threats she supposedly made. Apparently, she was planning on hurting herself, child/children (the 2 with her second husband) and her child's/children's caregivers. She also showed up to a meeting with her parole officer hammered and with her 3rd/4th husband in tow...apparently, the no contact order has expired so nobody was really violating their parole...they're both on parole...
The case worker called me so that we could arrange a police escort at the courthouse.  [roll]

Anyway, hearing day rolls around, the town we are headed to got 8 inches of snow the night before and was also experiencing extremely cold temps and gusty winds. Court got pushed back from 9:30am to 11:00am.
We get to the courthouse and almost immediately, 2 sheriff's deputies come over to our car and escort me and my daughter in.

In the conference room before the hearing, I hand over my request for concurrent jurisdiction for the purposes of pursuing custody of my daughter and removing her as a ward of the state of Missouri.
The state is OK. The Guardian Ad Litem is all for it and the juvenile court officer is supportive. Before the hearing, they take the order to the judge asking that it be entered during the hearing and signed.

Hearing starts, my ex wife asks to testify.

:o :o :o :o :o
She says, "I believe that it is in the best interests of our daughter to grant Ryan permanent and sole custody of Charlea. I will not pursue custody or visitation."
She also addresses several rambling diatribes in regards to the state, the courts and the case worker along with the sheriff that is investigating the threats.
She then requests, "one final visit with my daughter..." The judge denies it for that day as until the investigation is concluded, they will not allow her visitation without a UA and a law enforcement supervisor.

The judge signs the order granting concurrent jurisdiction and goes to recess.

After the hearing, my ex wife spoke with Charlea...there were tears but Charlea never even flinched.

I think having her on the outside looking in at the train wreck that are her sister and mother's lives, she wants nothing to do with it.
She has adjusted well to her new lifestyle. She has friends, a job (had 2 jobs for a while but the second job was at the mall during Christmas), she is doing exceptionally well in school and her and my wife are getting along better than ever before.

She still has teenager moments. She hasn't been (caught) smoking and I think that she is coming to the realization that I am very flexible as long as she is completely honest with me.
She has talked to me about her mom and she wishes that she would get better but is starting to accept that her mom is the only one who can make her better.

Next steps are having my attorney file for sole custody here in Iowa. Once that is filed and approved, no more trip to Missouri for foster care hearings.
The state of Iowa sent a case worker to do a "6 month" report...the case worker was stunned that I hadn't not yet been given full custody.

Anyway, things are smoothing out greatly. My ex wife is facing her demons and even though she isn't

very happy for you bud..
Cheers

That's great news to hear about how your youngest daughter is responding to living in a supportive, stable home environment.
You're one step closer to having a reasonably normal life.

Congrats!

BC.

About time. [thumbsup]

Very good news and glad to hear it.

Heading in the right direction.  [thumbsup]

Agree with Lethe!  Right direction!

JM

Nice [thumbsup]

Quote from: IZ on February 28, 2013, 10:48:13 PM
My TV is down though so I guess I know what to tune into for the next couple months!  [popcorn]

Well, sounds like everything might just work out.   [thumbsup]

Just in time too..I ended up getting my cable turned back on last night!   [laugh]

 [thumbsup]

Haven't followed this whole thread from the beginning since we have a full set of "Breaking Bad" disks and they've been providing all the drama I can deal with!  Very glad to hear that things are working out and I hope they continue to be positive.   Just a guess based on what your daughters been through, she's going to be a bit of an adrenaline junkie (not necessarily a bad thing) and it would be good if she could get involved in sports or something active and positive to hold her interest.  Disclaimer - I have zero experience raising a daughter.

Wow...didn't realize it has been this long since an update.

First, youngest daughter turned 17 this week. I asked her if she wanted to go visit her mom's to visit for Christmas and she flat out refused. She then asked if she could go to her aunt's house (her mom's sister) for a few days over Christmas break. During our conversation is comes out that Charlea is flat out tired of trying to be the adult and help her mom get better when it is clear that she doesn't (more on that below). School is still going well although, when pressed about what she wants to do after HS, she gets vague and non-committal. The unfortunate side effect of using your McDonalds manager "friends" as role models I guess. Hopefully she will get her head straightened out enough to focus on her future.
Right now, we have normal teenager problems and drama. Which is a vast improvement. So much so that her counselor finally relented and stated that Charlea only needs to see her when she feels like she wants to talk to someone other than friends/relatives.

Middle daughter is currently 8 months pregnant and living with her now husband. Neither of them have jobs and have this blatant "the state will take care of us" mentality that drives me bonkers. But I will stop with that as my rant would get too political.
She has been hosting her mother (more on that below) and apparently is entertained by her antics. Definitely something someone who is about to give birth needs in their life. /sarcasm
She has also been blasting me on Facebook about not letting her see her sister.
First, I work and am not willing to take time off from work or take my daughter out of school during the week to come visit her. When given the option on the weekends, my youngest daughter would rather have hours at work over visiting her sister. Second, I can't help it if her and her husband aren't working and don't have transportation to come up here. But apparently, I am "keeping her sister from seeing her". I called her out on it saying that maybe she should ask her sister if she would rather work/go to school or go visit her sister. 99 times out of 100, she will pick the former over the latter.


So my ex wife...where to start...
I do know that if I ever want to commit a felony, I am going to Missouri to do it.
So far, she has been in the hospital twice with overdoses. She had also moved into her Dad's place back in Iowa and had 4 "relapses" while there.
Her dad got sick of it and kicked her out so she went back to husband 3/4. They were living together in some shanty until they got kicked out of there. Now she is staying at my middle daughter's place and is definitely still using which was VERy evident from the videos my daughter has posted of her on Facebook.
Unfortunately, her sister and her mom keep enabling her/validating her. "It's OK Jenny...everyone has their own demons and just have to learn to live with them." and other asinine shit like that.
She hasn't reached out to Charlea in over 6 months but posts all kinds of bullshit on Facebook about how much she misses her.
I know that it is effecting my daughter as she worries about her but she is also at an age where she doesn't need the extra bullshit in her life.

Anyway, just wanted to throw up an update. For our part, things are going well. For their part, not so much but we have to focus on ours and they have to face theirs.

Glad to hear that you and your youngest are on a healthy path, and that she has finally seen the difference between a messed up life, and a good life with her own eyes.

In a month, you get to be a grandparent!
Here's to hoping your future grand-kid somehow makes it through life, and survives it's mom and grandma's influences.

BC.

Ouch,  guess I am not gonna cry about having to chase my dog down a couple of miles from home.....

Sounds like a lot to deal with.  Funny thing about people, some will only learn the hard way and all the advice in the world won't change a thing....
I grew up with parents that thought it was okay for The State to care for them.  It isn't.  I however am not going to blame The State so my rant is not political.

Good luck with the family and thanks for reminding me why I am so very glad mine is small.   [beer]

Well, caught my youngest smoking again.

And lying to me about it repeatedly.

"I was just holding her cigarette for her..."
Uh, I watched you take several drags...see...here you are taking another drag in the video.

And it isn't even the smoking thing that bothers me. It is the incessant lying about everything from little shit all the way to this.

I have 3 simple rules.
Don't lie to me.
Be considerate to those around you.
Clean up after yourself.

And she continually just pisses on those rules like they are the toughest rules on the planet.
She has even been caught lying to her friends. "My dad won't help me buy a car because he is having a hard time with bills." is one she told her friend who asked her what she was looking at for her first car. I told her that I would match anything she saved towards a car up to $3k.
I told her I would help her shop too since I have been around cars and car dealerships my whole life.
In fact, I found her several potential first cars that I would have loved to owned in my 30s let alone my teens.

Some days I ask myself why I didn't get a vasectomy when I was 12.

Welcome to parenthood.

Teenage girls suck, unless you're a teenage boy.

I had three of 'em for sisters, and watched my wife's teenage daughter turn into a young lady in her early 20's.
She's still a handful of "Why the hell can't you just do this/not do that?"

Good luck with that.

BC.

My barber insisted I read Strong Fathers, Strong Daughters.  I'm in the middle of reading it now.  Lots of common sense and it reaffirms my theory that some force out there is trying to label fathers as helpless buffoons and clowns. 

http://www.amazon.com/Strong-Fathers-Daughters-Secrets-Father/dp/0345499395 (http://www.amazon.com/Strong-Fathers-Daughters-Secrets-Father/dp/0345499395)

Zilbert, keep fighting the fight!


P.S. my barber is a very experienced former physiologist with a background in teenage girls. 

Great book recommendations. I have two wonderful daughters, 11 and 9.
Thanks heaps.
I'm going to order them.

Ordered the first one!

Cheers!

Better?

You could say that. She moved out and moved in with my brother and sister in law expecting more freedom but was surprised to find out that my brother and I have the same set of rules.

But she has grown up considerably. She is going to college for elementary education and is an assistant substitute teacher with the Des Moines Public Schools in a special ed program.

We go out for lunch once or twice a month and she has apologized to me and my wife for the shit she pulled.

But she is also prone to making mistakes as we all were in our late teens.

She's doing well, my wife and I are doing well. My middle daughter is pregnant with her second child and getting a divorce from her husband who has cheated on her since before they were married.
My ex wife is now living in an assisted living facility since her dad passed away and she can't take care of herself.

Better, not all bad, some very good - glad to hear  [thumbsup]

Quote from: stopintime on November 15, 2016, 02:59:45 PM
Better, not all bad, some very good - glad to hear  [thumbsup]

Ditto on that.