My S4Rs, at 16k miles, has started overheating in traffic. At 225 degrees it shuts itself off... I checked the fluid and the lines, and the fans come on at 205 though they can't keep up.. so I'm thinking bad water pump. There's a recall out there affecting 8 units and mine was built the month before, according to the sticker. Chances are slim but you never know. She's in for a check up at AMS. Anyone else experienced overheating this summer? Is this a normal liquid cooled Ducati thing?
I haven't had any issues with mine. I rode to work a couple of days last week and when riding home around 4pm the temp went up to 186 degrees. The temp outside was upper nineties. Sounds like a definite issue. Good luck with getting the issue resolved. Let us know the outcome.
Swanny
No first had experience yet with overheating on my bike, but I have yet to see a 225 off the coolant readings that the gauges give. It could be time for a coolant flush and refresh.
Quote from: newslacker on July 07, 2008, 01:39:09 PM
My S4Rs, at 16k miles, has started overheating in traffic. At 225 degrees it shuts itself off... I checked the fluid and the lines, and the fans come on at 205 though they can't keep up.. so I'm thinking bad water pump. There's a recall out there affecting 8 units and mine was built the month before, according to the sticker. Chances are slim but you never know. She's in for a check up at AMS. Anyone else experienced overheating this summer? Is this a normal liquid cooled Ducati thing?
It is a 2007.
It's under warranty.
It's at AMS.
I wouldn't worry any more about it.
Seriously.
Usually the temp gauge on my ass hits the red before the coolant gauge does on the 999... damn BBQ pit under the seat! Not to harp on jap bikes but I noticed my Gixxer never got over 168-172 on the Muenster ride... of course 100mph air flow helps! Was curious what Lisa's 999 was reading. Patrick, they are the same motors, your S4RS and my 999, never had that problem. Betcha AMS will figure it out. [thumbsup]
P-fhhht, I never look at my gauges - I'm too busy tryin' to stay outta y'all's way [laugh]
The cooling fans on the SBK click on around 200 degrees, drops the temps down to something like 180 or something... Almost always while I'm sitting at a light - ambient temps above 85 - so I can't say I've had any issues with over-heating.
From your description, I'd say it's a bad water pump.
Hit up AMS for an official ruling [thumbsup]
P.S.- Glad you're still alive [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup]
My ST4S recently got to 225 and did not shut down. Ambient temps were high 90s.
How've you been?
cdc
AMS called me back and they got it up to 230 without shutting down. This is bizarre to me since it has never run over 210 degrees. The fans typically keep it in a reasonable range. It has a tendency to cut out when just opening the throttle when it's hot, and that may explain the dying in traffic, but this behavior doesn't *feel* normal. They are going to ship it to Alvarado and look into it there. My gut tells me the bike isn't able to cool itself effectively, even after a coolant refresh.
Will the other S4Rs riders post their ambient readings with the current high-90s environment. Freeway and traffic readings appreciated.
I will be sans bike on Saturday. :'(
184 when cruising down the highway. When stopped at a light it pops up to about 200 but cools right back down when moving again.
I have never seen my bike go over 205 degrees.
Swanny
i'm going to have to look into this watercooling thing...the SS at highway speed on a regular warm TX day is usually 230F...stop and go will see 265-270F....and i've seen higher than that. she's a beast....you don't want any.
Quote from: McKraut on July 15, 2008, 01:18:01 PM
i'm going to have to look into this watercooling thing...the SS at highway speed on a regular warm TX day is usually 230F...stop and go will see 265-270F....and i've seen higher than that. she's a beast....you don't want any.
The temperature YOU see is OIL TEMPERATURE.
Different animal all together.
If it didn't get to be AT LEAST 220 I would WORRY. (no joke)
If it gets much over 350 add a second cooler...
Quote from: McKraut on July 15, 2008, 01:18:01 PM
i'm going to have to look into this watercooling thing...the SS at highway speed on a regular warm TX day is usually 230F...stop and go will see 265-270F....and i've seen higher than that. she's a beast....you don't want any.
Rich,
Get a temp guage that replaces the oil filler plug on the right hand side of the motor. Assuming that it is accurate, it will give you a "second opnion" of your oil temp to compare with what you stock guage reads. I saw one on DLS's Monster before it became Cher's bike which was her bike to begin with if she bought it new.... oh forget it.
cdc
http://www.monsterparts.com/pc/DTG/Accessories/DTG.html
Quote from: swanny on July 15, 2008, 01:08:14 PM
184 when cruising down the highway. When stopped at a light it pops up to about 200 but cools right back down when moving again.
I have never seen my bike go over 205 degrees.
Swanny
So Swanny is getting really close to what I was getting up until a few weeks ago. It'll still probably be a week before I get a new prognosis.
My guess is that this mechanical failure is going to take another 2 weeks to resolve, for a total of a month out of service. I would say that a second mode of transport is almost a necessity if this is typical for AMS/Ducati.
neat gauge...saw that on lisa's.... my oil temp gauge goes to 150 though.
Quote from: newslacker on July 15, 2008, 01:42:13 PM...I would say that a second mode of transport is almost a necessity if this is typical...
Yep.
It's a motorcycle.
An Italian motorcycle.
If you don't have backup transportation for inevitable service/crashes/repair you need to work on that!
I bet the local Honda dealer is backed-up farther than AMS is this time of the year.
You can't get your boat worked on right now either!
seriously, that would look Sweet next to your boost guage on your A Pillar!
May want to move this to the main tech section.
My S4RS routinely get into the low mid 230's range when I am stuck in traffic and inching my way towards the garage. The bike in generally does not shut-off. However, I have had the bike shut itself off pre-some mods and the general consensus on TOB was the bike is running a tad lean and will just shut-off once in a while when it get hot. Since those 2~3 occurances last year, I have not had it happen to me this year yet.
Quote from: CDawg on July 15, 2008, 01:50:48 PM
May want to move this to the main tech section.
But if we did that we wouldn't have the obscene total posts the DFW group has. Besides, Patrick doesn't really need an answer to his problem he just wants to make us feel better our Italian bikes are working. ;D
J/K Patrick.
***
CDawg
low-mid 230's sounds insane. If mine had always been like that I would consider it normal... but it wasn't.
DFWM is my home. I don't dare venture outside. Besides, this is more of a vent than a technical headache. If it weren't under warranty I would have pulled the water pump already.
...
Fortunately for me, I invested in base model Toyota Tacoma after I owned a Triumph Sprint ST for a while. I got tired of waiting on the elusive flat bed tow trucks to haul it to the shop.
Quote from: newslacker on July 15, 2008, 03:02:31 PM
DFWM is my home. I don't dare venture outside. Besides, this is more of a vent than a technical headache. If it weren't under warranty I would have pulled the water pump already.
Fair enough! Also SpeedyMoto makes a billeted H2O cover that is suppose to reduce engine temp by up to 10%
Quote from: newslacker on July 15, 2008, 01:42:13 PM
So Swanny is getting really close to what I was getting up until a few weeks ago. It'll still probably be a week before I get a new prognosis.
My guess is that this mechanical failure is going to take another 2 weeks to resolve, for a total of a month out of service. I would say that a second mode of transport is almost a necessity if this is typical for AMS/Ducati.
With all due respect to AMS (and since I don't want to piss them off since they have had my 916SPS for probably half of 2008!!) all the real serious tech work is being done by Jeff alone since Stuart left. Jordan is certainly a capable tech, no offense to him at all, he's a great guy. But he just doesn't have the years on him that Jeff and Stuart have. No matter how good Jordan is (and he is) you can't make up for 10-20 years of on hand experience over night. I heard they were getting another tech for Alvarado out of one of the tech schools and that he would need to get some Ducati certification under his belt. But he also would be new to the Ducati program.
I'm sure it is not an easy situation for AMS. They get a lot of work from all over the area and the state at large. Scott in Dallas is a good tech but he has to drop the tools at any minute to answer phones and sell bikes and parts. And as much as Jeff loves wrenching on the bikes and building engines he also has a business to run with two shops 50 miles apart. I do not envy their position. I can afford to be patient with the 916, it's not my daily transportation and has special "issues". :P I also don't envy the customer's dilemma either, especially when you have only one bike which may very well be your only mode of transportation. Not many other viable options in the DFW area. Have never heard anything wonderful about either of the other two shops that carry Ducatis in the metroplex. Patrick, hope your overheating problem is fixed quickly. It's not going to get any cooler around here any time soon.
Quote from: fastwin on July 15, 2008, 03:58:12 PM
With all due respect to AMS (and since I don't want to piss them off since they have had my 916SPS for probably half of 2008!!) all the real serious tech work is being done by Jeff alone since Stuart left. Jordan is certainly a capable tech, no offense to him at all, he's a great guy. But he just doesn't have the years on him that Jeff and Stuart have. No matter how good Jordan is (and he is) you can't make up for 10-20 years of on hand experience over night. I heard they were getting another tech for Alvarado out of one of the tech schools and that he would need to get some Ducati certification under his belt. But he also would be new to the Ducati program.
I'm sure it is not an easy situation for AMS. They get a lot of work from all over the area and the state at large. Scott in Dallas is a good tech but he has to drop the tools at any minute to answer phones and sell bikes and parts. And as much as Jeff loves wrenching on the bikes and building engines he also has a business to run with two shops 50 miles apart. I do not envy their position. I can afford to be patient with the 916, it's not my daily transportation and has special "issues". :P I also don't envy the customer's dilemma either, especially when you have only one bike which may very well be your only mode of transportation. Not many other viable options in the DFW area. Have never heard anything wonderful about either of the other two shops that carry Ducatis in the metroplex. Patrick, hope your overheating problem is fixed quickly. It's not going to get any cooler around here any time soon.
whoa whoa whoa whoa......whoa. did you just leave a space between two lines...esentially creating a paragraph structure to your post?? dude...WTH? who are you and what did you do with fastwin?!
I'm
not
saying.
[cheeky]
Quote from: McKraut on July 15, 2008, 04:05:07 PM
whoa whoa whoa whoa......whoa. did you just leave a space between two lines...essentially creating a paragraph structure to your post?? dude...WTH? who are you and what did you do with fastwin?!
We came just a "Triple-spaced-indention" from the universe as we know it unraveling at our feet!
Jeezuz... fasty... Dude,
BE CAREFUL with that stuff...
Dr. Peter Venkman: This city is headed for a disaster of biblical proportions.
Mayor: What do you mean, "biblical"?
Dr Ray Stantz: What he means is Old Testament, Mr. Mayor, real wrath of God type stuff.
Dr. Peter Venkman: Exactly.
Dr Ray Stantz: Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!
Dr. Egon Spengler: Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes...
Winston Zeddemore: The dead rising from the grave!
Dr. Peter Venkman: Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!
And then come the BORG and we will be assimilated. Witness the people running around with devices in their ears. They say it's a bluetooth device but I know better. The BORG are here!!! [evil] [evil] [evil]
***
I was noseying around the other parts of the DMF board and came across a thread that got jacked midway into the discussion. Then some guy blasted the threadjacker saying his post was inappropriate blah, blah, blah.
I thought it was funny how he reacted to the threadjack. That guy better not get lost and find his way here or he'll go crazy. ;D
OK, continue...
cdc
I think we have a communal mindset here on this board. Everyone is free to threadjack as they wish upon their own free will. How cosmic 70's kinda thing is that bro? I'm thinking cool and groovy dude! Don't want no dudes casting any bad karma this way bro'!! Hey, we are talking free love on this board baby! Like wow dude! Take your bad thread jack and go somewhere else man. No bad karma here man. Like I said dude!! Hubba hubba man. Don't make me bust out out my woodie cruiser! I'm talking a real wood 60's style surf board hauler daddy'o! OK, how many people did I loose on that one!!... I thought so... :P OK, enough fun for me... I'm going to bed! Chiao!
Quote from: cdc on July 15, 2008, 08:13:44 PM...I thought it was funny how he reacted to the threadjack. That guy better not get lost and find his way here or he'll go crazy. ;D...
Well then, at that point, he will fit right in -won't he! ;D
Quote from: fastwin on July 15, 2008, 08:44:57 PM
I think we have a communal mindset here on this board. Everyone is free to threadjack as they wish upon their own free will. How cosmic 70's kinda thing is that bro? I'm thinking cool and groovy dude!...
I loved Hunter S. Thompsons noting a flyer at the DEA conference in vegas in
Fear and Loathing.
The Four stages of acceptance into the drug culture: Square, Hip, Cool and Groovy, and what each term meant relative to an individuals position in that society...
I gotta' read that one again.
Funny book! [thumbsup]
I had no idea AMS was that backed up. I'm still committed to them working on it. It seems like it must be the water pump and should be covered under warranty. Also, I'm using the lack of a bike as an excuse to work from home more. When I get the bike back I'll only be riding in twice a week (60 mile round trip).
This water pump housing looks pretty neat, except for the cost:
https://secure.speedymoto.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=WPC
Anyone seen one of these before? Looks pretty cool and is functional!
I remember seeing a picture of some guy with it on his S4R. It looked great and it held up great in a crash. It was just rashed up a bit, but was functional
Quote from: SUPER POOPER on July 15, 2008, 09:23:20 PM
Well then, at that point, he will fit right in -won't he! ;D
I loved Hunter S. Thompsons noting a flyer at the DEA conference in vegas in Fear and Loathing.
The Four stages of acceptance into the drug culture: Square, Hip, Cool and Groovy, and what each term meant relative to an individuals position in that society...
I gotta' read that one again.
Funny book! [thumbsup]
Teeth like baseballs, eyes like jellied fire. HST
Quote from: newslacker on July 16, 2008, 09:15:38 AM
I had no idea AMS was that backed up.
maybe they ate WAY too much bread....because that'll happen.
Quote from: newslacker on July 16, 2008, 09:15:38 AM
This water pump housing looks pretty neat, except for the cost:
https://secure.speedymoto.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=WPC
Mmm... Shiny!
Quote from: McKraut on July 16, 2008, 10:57:51 AM
maybe they ate WAY too much bread....because that'll happen.
Which is why u've got to eet ur meat...
How-can-u-have-any-pudding if u dooen't eet ur meat?
Yeah - deal with it [evil]
92 more posts to become a hero. ;D
Hey, reply to this! At least you will have another post!
Quote from: fastwin on July 16, 2008, 09:07:04 PM
Hey, reply to this! At least you will have another post!
Uhh thanks! 91 more post to become a hero.
cdc
Quote from: newslacker on July 16, 2008, 09:15:38 AM
I had no idea AMS was that backed up. I'm still committed to them working on it. It seems like it must be the water pump and should be covered under warranty. Also, I'm using the lack of a bike as an excuse to work from home more. When I get the bike back I'll only be riding in twice a week (60 mile round trip).
Yo, SuperSlackMan- any word from AMS?
I'm too afraid to call them back.
did the right side need to be reversed? I'll check it out 2nite
Quote from: *** on July 17, 2008, 06:56:36 AM
Uhh thanks! 91 more post to become a hero.
cdc
Not a Hero yet... [roll]
Quote from: newslacker on July 17, 2008, 10:40:33 AM
I'm too afraid to call them back.
"There is nothing to fear, except fear itself", Kermit the Frog.
Quote from: hiero on July 21, 2008, 10:53:02 AM
;D
yeah...that's actually very hard to argue. though there are quite a few other hero types in this little LSD group...
Quote from: McKraut on July 24, 2008, 09:11:22 PM
yeah...that's actually very hard to argue. though there are quite a few other hero types in this little LSD group...
[laugh] I was thinking more along the name rather than the actual abilities and worthiness of the title...
Quote from: hiero on July 24, 2008, 10:12:17 PM
[laugh] I was thinking more along the name rather than the actual abilities and worthiness of the title...
dude, it's okay to acknowledge "you're the man"
It's fixed!
In the end, it was an extreme lean condition that led to that overheating. It had nothing to do with the cooling system... I was so very wrong (I need to stick to computer crap). Jeff said the fuel filter was "heavier than any I think I have ever seen." On top of the fuel filter replacement, there were some plugs missing from the canister-ectomy on the air intake side, misrouted fuel lines, and the front belt was "so tight it could have snapped." I don't know why Jeff was looking at the belts, but it's a good thing that he did.
Thanks go to Jeff for taking this Friday afternoon and early evening to sort out all these issues, and Scott for seeing this through and prioritizing the service after some miscommunication. They also apologized several times for the backlog, which seems to be around 3 weeks.
What happened was due in part to my cost cutting efforts. I took the bike in to the west side Euro dealer for the 12/15k service (I still don't know which schedule my bike is on) because they were cheaper, and just did an oil change for the 6000/7500 interval. Historically I have found their service department lackluster and this case was no different. I have found them less than ideal for even routine maintenance as the additional expense of sorting out this overheating issue ($325) shows that they aren't doing even an adequate job. The fuel filter was not checked, belts were tightened incorrectly, and it was running very lean.
Fortunately I have come away with a running motorcycle... [moto]
Sounds very similar to Cory's poor running S4RS. Wasn't overheating, just was running worse as miles rolled on. Clogged fuel filter. Had nothing to do with the ECU or tuning. Just good old fashioned shitty gas. Cory said he thought it went back to a questionable fill up on the last Hill Country run, Running low on fuel and HAD to gas up at an ancient station with above ground, elevated fuel tanks. :P
It's nice getting screwed up stuff taken care of and get confidence in your ride. Hope it's all good now.
Quote from: fastwin on July 26, 2008, 03:01:35 PM
Sounds very similar to Cory's poor running S4RS. Wasn't overheating, just was running worse as miles rolled on. Clogged fuel filter. Had nothing to do with the ECU or tuning. Just good old fashioned shitty gas. Cory said he thought it went back to a questionable fill up on the last Hill Country run, Running low on fuel and HAD to gas up at an ancient station with above ground, elevated fuel tanks. :P
I wish I could trace this back to a questionable fill but alas, I've never used anything less than 91 octane in it. I do frequent this one particular RaceTrac more than any other station because it's cheap and on the way to work... have been going to the same one for 8 months straight. Don't they have some kind of warranty for bad gas? :)
Wow. Glad that you got your bike fixed Patrick. I wonder if there could be a defect in the fuel filter on the S4RS or there was a bad batch made.
Swanny
Quote from: newslacker on July 26, 2008, 02:16:11 PM
there were some plugs missing from the canister-ectomy on the air intake side,
misrouted fuel lines, and the front belt was "so tight it could have snapped."
I took the bike in to the west side Euro dealer for the 12/15k service (I still don't know which schedule my bike is on) because they were cheaper, and just did an oil change for the 6000/7500 interval. Historically I have found their service department lackluster and this case was no different. I have found them less than ideal for even routine maintenance as the additional expense of sorting out this overheating issue ($325) shows that they aren't doing even an adequate job. The fuel filter was not checked, belts were tightened incorrectly, and it was running very lean.
Glad she's running like she should, Patrick. [thumbsup] [moto]
So, did the other dealer do the canister-ectomy and mis-route the fuel lines? Which plugs were missing? ???
I hate to hear that the problems continue for you with service there. I am about to need my 7k and was trying to decide where to go--for the same reason you cite--cost, and I was also thinking wait time. After reading this, I may have decided. :P
Quote from: newslacker on July 26, 2008, 03:06:56 PM
I wish I could trace this back to a questionable fill but alas, I've never used anything less than 91 octane in it. I do frequent this one particular RaceTrac more than any other station because it's cheap and on the way to work... have been going to the same one for 8 months straight. Don't they have some kind of warranty for bad gas? :)
i think racetrac warrantees their gas, for whatever that might be worth.
Hate to be a buzzkill but good freaking luck trying to get them to pay your AMS service bill. Not that I have any knowledge of racetrac's fuel guarantee but the cynic in me makes me think it's a total BS advertising gimic. I can't imagine the ocean of legal crap you'd have to wade through to prove that their fuel caused the filter problem. Guess I spent too many damn years around attorneys and judges. But it did make me a realist. Just glad your scooter is better and it wasn't anything more costly. [thumbsup]
Glad to hear you got this sorted out for you. [thumbsup]
Good god, if you had snapped the belt or melted a piston... :o
GLAD it didn't come down to THAT.
Sometimes it can be hard to talk myself into paying a little extra for "the good stuff"
But then I get to thinking...
"if I save $50 on a tire and it's not quite good enough what will THAT cost me"
"if I take it to a cheap mechanic who doesn't catch something what will THAT cost me"
Etc.....
VERY HAPPY for you!!! [clap]
I was kidding about the warrantee bit at RaceTrac, I know, and they know, that pursing any claim is not worth the cost in money or time. I'm just glad that it's all sorted so I can ride again.
...
I typically go after the good stuff, I bought Ducati for a reason... I wanted an S4R for 2 years before I bought this one, and it has been all that I hoped it would be. However, when faced with $1000 per 7500 mile service fees... I have to ponder my financial sensibilities. :)
Quote from: newslacker on July 26, 2008, 08:53:58 PM
I was kidding about the warrantee bit at RaceTrac, I know, and they know, that pursing any claim is not worth the cost in money or time. I'm just glad that it's all sorted so I can ride again.
...
I typically go after the good stuff, I bought Ducati for a reason... I wanted an S4R for 2 years before I bought this one, and it has been all that I hoped it would be. However, when faced with $1000 per 7500 mile service fees... I have to ponder my financial sensibilities. :)
believe me, i hear you there, man... especially when that service cost comes to almost 25% of the value of the bike... :-\
Quote from: newslacker on July 26, 2008, 08:53:58 PM
I typically go after the good stuff, I bought Ducati for a reason... I wanted an S4R for 2 years before I bought this one, and it has been all that I hoped it would be. However, when faced with $1000 per 7500 mile service fees... I have to ponder my financial sensibilities. :)
Hate to be buzzkill #2 but as much as I love my Ducatis I love my rice rockets just as much. This might be considered heresy or treason but the lower entry prices are hard to beat and the service is zero. Well almost zero when compared to Ducatis. Parts and aftermarket parts are everywhere and by Ducati or Termi standards dirt cheap. There is an advantage to their crazy two year life span cycle. When your bikes are a model or two old then all the aftermarket parts get discounted. The Akrapovic pipes on my Gixxers were heavily discounted and the Ohlins shocks too. My Gixxers are both passed their "sell by date" (hell, I'm passed my sell by date!!!) but try and get me to believe that! They still look great to me, handle and ride great and both are faster than I will ever ride. A whole lot of bang for the buck.
It is a great tribute to Ducati that they can compete so effectively in today's marketplace with the Japanese manufacturers. There is a aura of something special and out of the ordinary with Ducati that the Jap bikes just can't build into an assembly line. That old world Italian craftmanship, design and racing history. It's certainly not the same but Harley has that same sort of aura of American iron and muscle that draws so many owners. Some folks feel the Jap bikes are cheap, poorly made and soul-less. I certainly don't feel that way but if I did I am lucky enough to have a Ducati to ride to make up for it.
... now, if those parts weren't so darned expensive and the $100/hour shop rate. Ouch! But we all knew that going into it. If you want a diamond from De Beers instead of a cubic zirconia you already know what you're in for. [moto]
Quote from: fastwin on July 27, 2008, 09:14:58 AM
Hate to be buzzkill #2 but as much as I love my Ducatis I love my rice rockets just as much. This might be considered heresy or treason but the lower entry prices are hard to beat and the service is zero. Well almost zero when compared to Ducatis. Parts and aftermarket parts are everywhere and by Ducati or Termi standards dirt cheap. There is an advantage to their crazy two year life span cycle. When your bikes are a model or two old then all the aftermarket parts get discounted. The Akrapovic pipes on my Gixxers were heavily discounted and the Ohlins shocks too. My Gixxers are both passed their "sell by date" (hell, I'm passed my sell by date!!!) but try and get me to believe that! They still look great to me, handle and ride great and both are faster than I will ever ride. A whole lot of bang for the buck.
It is a great tribute to Ducati that they can compete so effectively in today's marketplace with the Japanese manufacturers. There is a aura of something special and out of the ordinary with Ducati that the Jap bikes just can't build into an assembly line. That old world Italian craftmanship, design and racing history. It's certainly not the same but Harley has that same sort of aura of American iron and muscle that draws so many owners. Some folks feel the Jap bikes are cheap, poorly made and soul-less. I certainly don't feel that way but if I did I am lucky enough to have a Ducati to ride to make up for it.
... now, if those parts weren't so darned expensive and the $100/hour shop rate. Ouch! But we all knew that going into it. If you want a diamond from De Beers instead of a cubic zirconia you already know what you're in for. [moto]
Don't worry about buzzkill around here Brian. :) We all know full well what the total cost of ownership of a Ducati is... but where else do you find this kind of community? It's a rare thing to find a bunch of eccentrics that get along so well. ;)
Quote from: fastwin on July 27, 2008, 09:14:58 AM
Hate to be buzzkill #2 but as much as I love my Ducatis I love my rice rockets just as much. This might be considered heresy or treason but the lower entry prices are hard to beat and the service is zero. Well almost zero when compared to Ducatis. Parts and aftermarket parts are everywhere and by Ducati or Termi standards dirt cheap. There is an advantage to their crazy two year life span cycle. When your bikes are a model or two old then all the aftermarket parts get discounted. The Akrapovic pipes on my Gixxers were heavily discounted and the Ohlins shocks too. My Gixxers are both passed their "sell by date" (hell, I'm passed my sell by date!!!) but try and get me to believe that! They still look great to me, handle and ride great and both are faster than I will ever ride. A whole lot of bang for the buck.
It is a great tribute to Ducati that they can compete so effectively in today's marketplace with the Japanese manufacturers. There is a aura of something special and out of the ordinary with Ducati that the Jap bikes just can't build into an assembly line. That old world Italian craftmanship, design and racing history. It's certainly not the same but Harley has that same sort of aura of American iron and muscle that draws so many owners. Some folks feel the Jap bikes are cheap, poorly made and soul-less. I certainly don't feel that way but if I did I am lucky enough to have a Ducati to ride to make up for it.
... now, if those parts weren't so darned expensive and the $100/hour shop rate. Ouch! But we all knew that going into it. If you want a diamond from De Beers instead of a cubic zirconia you already know what you're in for. [moto]
That sounds like the Corvette vs Ferrari debate; one is mass-produced *cheap* with lots of performance and the other has lots of performance with the "right" pedigree but is insanely expensive to keep. I'd
like to have a Ferrari (who wouldn't?) but at some point the money vs benefit issue gets to be, well... a decision based on, "is it
really worth it ?" Everyone has their own answer. (Jury is still out on the Ferrari Question [laugh] ).
The Japanese brands vs Ducati thing fall into the same category. For me, the Ducati
is worth the 'insanely expensive to keep' scenario. I put a big premium on Ducati racing history, craftsmanship, and style which the Italians seem to have masterd a long time ago. Not everyone is going to care about the same things so the Ducati "mystique" is totally meaningless to them and therefore a terrible value.
But yeah Brian, I agree 100% - in a perfect world, we'd all own both a CBZXGSXR1 and Duc [evil] [laugh]
Oh yeah, almost forgot - I'm glad you've got your bike running normally Patrick! Woo-Hoo [thumbsup]
Quote from: n2f on July 27, 2008, 10:06:40 AM
But yeah Brian, I agree 100% - in a perfect world, we'd all own both a CBZXGSXR1 and Duc [evil] [laugh]
I really only want one bike and I think the CBZXGSXR1 could be it!
Quote from: newslacker on July 27, 2008, 11:52:59 AM
I really only want one bike and I think the CBZXGSXR1 could be it!
Well just save your lunch money and buy the new BMW sport bike they're going to race next year in WSBK [evil]
Quote from: fastwin on July 27, 2008, 09:14:58 AM
Hate to be buzzkill #2 but as much as I love my Ducatis I love my rice rockets just as much. This might be considered heresy or treason but the lower entry prices are hard to beat and the service is zero.
actually, i think pretty much everyone at least in our little group tends to have some very favorable opinions of a lot of japanese bikes. i like quite a few of them myself.
Quote from: McKraut on July 27, 2008, 03:18:34 PM
actually, i think pretty much everyone at least in our little group tends to have some very favorable opinions of a lot of japanese bikes. i like quite a few of them myself.
i like whatever has two wheels and an engine from old school panhead bobbers to 916, 1098 to GSXR1000
i never rode a bike that i didnt like... ;)
Im thinking once I get a Monser Ill have my sites set on a CBR or GSXR in the liter range. I like all bikes even HD ( did I just say that :o ) its usually the demographic that they cater to that doesnt sit well with me. :-\
I also am a lover of all things two wheeled. Just got hooked on that whole gyroscopic effect thing as a tyke and I am still trying to figure it out. :P Just like life, you have to keep moving or you will lose momentum and fall over. Damn gravity. I also haven't ever ridden anything that didn't make me smile... it all started with a 1968 Rupp mini bike and where it stops no one knows!! [thumbsup] [moto] [bacon]
Quote from: fastwin on July 28, 2008, 06:46:41 AM
I also am a lover of all things two wheeled. Just got hooked on that whole gyroscopic effect thing as a tyke and I am still trying to figure it out. :P Just like life, you have to keep moving or you will lose momentum and fall over. Damn gravity. I also haven't ever ridden anything that didn't make me smile... it all started with a 1968 Rupp mini bike and where it stops no one knows!! [thumbsup] [moto] [bacon]
Honda Mini Trail 70 [thumbsup]
Quote from: Kevin848 on July 28, 2008, 06:48:14 AM
Honda Mini Trail 70 [thumbsup]
Suzuki DS 80
Thread Jack!
Quote from: Kevin848 on July 28, 2008, 06:56:42 AM
I blame Fastwin
Like I haven't heard that before... I'm used to it. [thumbsup]
Yamaha T50 Townmate when i was 12yold still have it , one day ill restore it.. ;)
it does make the argument that the trade in for an '08 has some financially appealing aspects of it, given the new longer service intervals... or, just by more bikes and ride them all just a bit less....