BMW F800 GS

[ducatania]

One thing I noticed during my first couple of trips to the shop is that even though they carry Ducati, Harley Dav...uh, I mean MV Agusta, BMW, and Triumph, all of the employees ride Ducati. 

That's probably because of Ducati's employee purchase plan. If you work for a Ducati dealer, you can buy a bike well below dealer cost. The other manufacturers you mention probably don't offer anything like that.  I know BMW doesn't I paid significantly more for my BMW ST than I could have gotten an ST3 for.

[ducatania]

Anyone duc owners owned a BMW bike before?  So I've been reading about this F800 GS and decided to stop by the local dealer to learn what I can about BMW (i know nothing about the brand). The bike has great specs, looks sexy, and is a whole lot more affordable than the 1200. But I left the dealer with more questions than I came in with and with a bad taste in my mouth. I want to love this bike but...

There's lots of mis-conceptions and just plain wrong stuff posted about BMWs on here, maybe I can clear some of your questions up...

(1) ABS:  I asked the dealer if I could get the bike without it. He said not unless I pay for the entire bike upfront AND he couldn't give me an estimate on when it would arrive, and it might not arrive until next year. He said basically he'd have to order it on next allocation if an empty slot shows up (but he could get me one with ABS by August). He explained if he ordered it and someone didn't take it, it would be impossible to sell the bike without ABS. He said he wouldn't ride a bike without ABS (how many bikes have this??) so I know how ABS on a car works..and I asked him if it similarly pulsates the braking pressure, and he said it doesn't. But he couldn't really tell me how it works. I don't know about you, but the thought of computer controlled ABS on a bike freaks me the hell out. anyone have experience with this?

The dealers don't know for sure when the F800GS are going to show up or even what the final price on them is going to be yet. When BMW releases a new model, they ship them out pretty well optioned with the popular choices, the dealer has very little input unless they are custom ordering a bike for a customer. Once the initial allocation had been shipped they get a little more leeway on how they want the bikes optioned. So he was correct in that if you want a bike without ABS, you'll be at least 6 months out. I saw this when the R1200S was released. 99.9% of BMW riders want ABS, so yeah he's going to want to make absolutely sure you're taking the bike if you don't want ABS, hence the advance payment in full. He doesn't want to be stuck with a bike that would be tough to sell if you change your mind when it came in.

(2) Traction control: uhh.. isn't this bike an enduro? now I understand how positraction works, but how does this work with one wheel? how effective could it possibly be on a bike and why would you ever need this? He couldn't explain it but said at least I could turn it off with button.

You can turn it off when off-road, just like ABS. The BMW system measures difference in wheel speed between the front and rear wheels and if they get out of whack, it retards spark and if that isn't enough interrupts FI.  It's useful in wet or slippery conditions in that it prevents the rear wheel from spinning up. Down side is no more burn-outs or wheelies.   

(3) Accessories: he said you can only use BMW-approved electronic accessories because the bike uses a "single wire" system that is proprietary to the bike. so you couldn't put in 3rd party electronic things on the bike. why is this a good thing?

That's not entirely true, you can still wire stuff directly to the battery and not have to go through the CANBUS system. I have a second accessory outlet on my bike wired directly to the battery so I can run accessories over 5 amps like a second heated vest or air pump. My Nav system is also wired directly to the battery.

(4) Heated grips: ok this is not a big deal but when we were talking about ABS, he said the grips come in a package with the ABS and if I didn't get the ABS I wouldn't get the heated grips either..I reminded him that we're in southern Florida.. he gave me a weird look and said "but heated grips are what BMW's are known for." I guess, but I mean, I'll never, ever use them..

There's nothing worse than riding with cold hands and even in FL, you can have chilly mornings or when you're riding in the rain. Trus me, if you have them, you'll use them. 

(5) Wrenching: he said the most one could do is change the oil, change the bulbs (he actually said this), lube the chain. Valves can't be done yourself. Even working on your brakes (flushing/bleeding) can't be done because they're integrated with the ABS and the computer. isn't wrenching half the fun? how much do you end up spending at the dealer every year?

IIRC, I've heard that the valves are a pregnant dog to get to on the F800s, that may be what he was referring to. I know on the K-bikes, they use the diagnostic computer to let the techs know when the valves need to be adjusted. It may be the same with the new F bikes? Modern BMWs are pretty dependent on factory tools and diagnostic computers. The ABS brakes need to be flushed every two years, there may be special tools required for it. It's about 2-3 hours labor.

(6) the computer: So, the new F650 has the exact same 800cc engine, same compression, same valve sizes... BUT has 14 less HP. he said it was detuned and had something to do with the computer. he couldn't say what exactly though, in fact they asked around the dealership and no one knew if it was fuel mapping or what. he said they did that to offer a lower price point bike. he said they can't change it. it just seems like this is wrong to artificially restrict torque like that. the 650 is actually more ideal for me (has a low suspension option, it's lighter) but I couldn't live with knowing it's intentionally restricted and there's nothing I can do about it. have people hacked these themselves? will that void your warranty (since you're probably going to need it given all the proprietary stuff)?

I can't imagine BMW giving the dealer software to up the HP on the "650" as that would cut into F800 sales. Not gonna happen even if it is just a software upgrade. The F650 version isn't out yet either so I doubt anyone has "hacked it, but yes that would DEFINITELY void your warranty. 

[mitt]

I would like a 1200GS, and even though the dealer in my area is considered above average, I still don't really like their vibs - very clicky and selective when having things like demo days - example - guys with gray hair & already owning a bmw get all the demo rides and the 25-40 year old /ducati/Japenese riders can go pound sand (which is exactly the age demo that bmw struggles to attract - imagine why).

mitt

[NuTTs]

wow Kurt that is a big bike - is that what you are replacing your last beemer with?  very capable but very much a different bike.  I wouldn't say its the same thing as an F800 GS as the big adventure weighs in at something like 540lbs fully fueled...

advrider is good for many things but in a fit of retardation the mods have lumped everything about the F800 GS into one gigantic thread making it difficult to find specific info.  but at least they have a first-rate boobies thread 

She is a big old thing, even if the bike´s fully loaded with stuff.. as soon as she get´s home it´s diet time. I´m gonna do the first GS Adventure bobber. I´ll keep all the bits for when I sell the bike on.

I missed their boobie thread?? wtf!!!

[hydra]

i've owned 3 bmw's since '94 when i bought a new R1100GS. at the time i had a '80 kawa KZ1000 and a '73 harley (still have it). i absoultey have never regretted buying that bike. very low maintenance and just ate up any road surface with ease. didn't get another bike until i saw a Boxer Cup Replika one day on ebay and after finding one on craigslist and bought it 2 years ago. i rode the GS a lot less and sold it about a year ago. then my brother bought a harley then had a baby and was looking to sell his Rockster (R1150R), so i bought it from him for a screaming family price that i couldn't refuse. the rockster was bmw's attempt at the naked bike...

i ended up crashing the rockster and ins co wanted to salvage the bike. well i took the money and picked up the Foggy  [moto]
i've always wanted a ducati but the last 2 bikes were really good deals that happened quickly. i've still got my BCR and love it and will never sell it. it's 2 different rides that have their own appealing qualities. roll on's on the bmw is like a spinning top whereas the ducati is like a catapult.

anyways, you might want to look into an R12GS like NuTTs did. i rented one for a week and the 1200 engine is really sweet. you could find them used for a decent price. but the GS models are all really incredible all purpose bikes. lots of fun in the twisties, although you might not think it but my GS was an incredible canyon carver, all weather, road eating, adventure  machine. but alas, i'm looking for more sporty horizons as i get older. trackdays are starting to be such an addiction...
and i'm completely obsessed with my monster!

best of luck on your decision. you won't regret buying a bmw. don't let that particular dealership (or stupid salesman) turn you off. there is a big bmw community and lots of help on the forums. i hang out a lot at the pelicans parts (prosche parts) forums. they have a section for the bmw R11S/R12S. but the forum discusses all bmw models. lots of poepeoplepe doing their own maintenance. bmw based but a bunch of ducati owners there and is open to any bike related topic. you're sure to get some solid advice over there as well. check out ewan mcgregor's "long way down" series where they crossed africa from north to south on the R12GS and "long way round" on R1150GS from london the soviet union, mongolia, alaska and eventually to NYC.

http://www.longwaydown.com/
http://www.longwayround.com/html/lwr_dvm.html


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=24

[NuTTs]

I went to see my bike today, man it´s evil looking. I tried out a F800GS for size, it does look more apt for off road duty than the 1200GS I guess, weighs around 45kg less also. I don´t like the 21" front wheel as I´d personally not ride it in the dirt at all except the odd fire track or gravel road but, I can see the appeal. It is a LOT cheaper than the 1200GS but at the same time the guys who work at the dealership (like a big, happy family) all said the same thing - the power delivery is flat and very boring compared to the F800S or ST. I think it looks mean in yellow/black with the Akrapovic silencer.

[ducatania]

I would like a 1200GS, and even though the dealer in my area is considered above average, I still don't really like their vibs - very clicky and selective when having things like demo days - example - guys with gray hair & already owning a bmw get all the demo rides and the 25-40 year old /ducati/Japenese riders can go pound sand (which is exactly the age demo that bmw struggles to attract - imagine why).

mitt

Who's the dealer near you? Gina's?

[ducatania]

I went to see my bike today, man it´s evil looking. I tried out a F800GS for size, it does look more apt for off road duty than the 1200GS I guess, weighs around 45kg less also. I don´t like the 21" front wheel as I´d personally not ride it in the dirt at all except the odd fire track or gravel road but, I can see the appeal. It is a LOT cheaper than the 1200GS but at the same time the guys who work at the dealership (like a big, happy family) all said the same thing - the power delivery is flat and very boring compared to the F800S or ST. I think it looks mean in yellow/black with the Akrapovic silencer.

The F800GS is really replacing the old F650GS Dakar. It's really more for off-road than on.

[hydra]

I went to see my bike today, man it´s evil looking. I tried out a F800GS for size, it does look more apt for off road duty than the 1200GS I guess, weighs around 45kg less also. I don´t like the 21" front wheel as I´d personally not ride it in the dirt at all except the odd fire track or gravel road but, I can see the appeal. It is a LOT cheaper than the 1200GS but at the same time the guys who work at the dealership (like a big, happy family) all said the same thing - the power delivery is flat and very boring compared to the F800S or ST. I think it looks mean in yellow/black with the Akrapovic silencer.

hey nutts,

so you're going to replace the HP2 with the GS huh? i hope you're healing well.

[jkris]

Thanks all for your advice.  In the end I decided that heated grips, proprietary electrics, and roadside assistance (if the dealer mentioned that one more time...) were not things I needed or wanted to pay for. 

I ultimately went with a used Multistroodle and never realized what a freakin awesome bike it is--lighter, LOTS of torque, comfortable all-day riding position, able to be wrenched and modded, and literally at a third of the price of the F800.  She's moody at low RPM and looks funky, but in the end, these are the things you fall in love with.

[silentbob]

Thanks all for your advice.  In the end I decided that heated grips, proprietary electrics, and roadside assistance (if the dealer mentioned that one more time...) were not things I needed or wanted to pay for. 

I ultimately went with a used Multistroodle and never realized what a freakin awesome bike it is--lighter, LOTS of torque, comfortable all-day riding position, able to be wrenched and modded, and literally at a third of the price of the F800.  She's moody at low RPM and looks funky, but in the end, these are the things you fall in love with.

Excellent choice.  I think they are the most comfortable bike I have ridden, even compared to my Harley, ST4, and BMW.  What model did you get?

[jkris]

It is a 2005 1000s DS.  The previous owner put in the 14t countersprocket and a rizoma bar with slightly more sweep.  I think it's fine as it is, but I might add some Rox risers to compensate for my shortness and so I can sit further back in the seat a little more.