http://movies.yahoo.com/blogs/movie-news/breaking--philip-seymour-hoffman-found-dead-at-46-184225678.html (http://movies.yahoo.com/blogs/movie-news/breaking--philip-seymour-hoffman-found-dead-at-46-184225678.html)
Wow.
RIP
sadly another junkie
from Yahoo:
The actor was found with a needle in his arm and apparent heroin was found at the scene.
even sadder:
He has three children, Tallulah Hoffman, Cooper Alexander Hoffman and Willa Hoffman, all under the age of 11
That is really make the beast with two backsed up, dude was a great actor.
Heroin is never good. Hope that wasn't the case here.
RIP
My thoughts and prayers to his kiddos and their Mom.
Wow. One of the greats. What a huge loss.
Reminds me of Dion Sanders great advise to Russle Wilson last night. "There will be a lot of left turns ahead of you now. Just keep going right. Just keep going right."
I loved this guy, what a fantastic actor. By far , for me ,his best role was in charlie wilsons war.
RIP
When Marco died... people said, " he died doing what he loved. "
When Joey Dunlop died... people said, " he died doing what he loved. "
When Ayrton Senna died... people said, " he died doing what he loved. "
Will people say the same for Philip?
Clearly the man had demons that caused him to care more for a drug, than that of his children... and I find that sad.
Quote from: bobspapa on February 03, 2014, 05:48:33 PM
When Marco died... people said, " he died doing what he loved. "
When Joey Dunlop died... people said, " he died doing what he loved. "
When Ayrton Senna died... people said, " he died doing what he loved. "
Will people say the same for Philip?
Clearly the man had demons that caused him to care more for a drug, than that of his children... and I find that sad.
fwiw, his history of substance abuse and addiction pre-dates fatherhood.
to your earlier point, i'm not sure you could say one "loves" heroin more than their children, just that they can't stop chasing that feeling (or lack of) it gives.
maybe it's just me....but I would think having children would be enough of a reason to want to stay sober.
I read a past interview of his where he claimed to love drugs and alcohol... that's why I wrote love, and not chasing a high.
It can be argued that Joey, Marco, and Senna were also chasing a high.
A different kind of high, but one none the less.
I've always disliked that saying that someone died doing what they loved. No one loves being run over during a race. I had a great friend get killed a coupla weekends ago. Riding was what he loved, not low siding and crashing into a pole at 100mph.
Regarding addiction, it most often trumps all of our basic needs including concern for family, friends, etc. It's terribly sad.
Loved Hoffman in Doubt and Mr. Ripley.
He was an entertainer, that's all. He lived a rarefied lifestyle because of his access and acclaim, but we all know we give too much importance to entertainers.
It's sad he died because he had a family and was a human being.
Everything else is just BS.
Who knows what he would have done tomorrow? Pulled a Brando and lived on a desert island banging 13 year olds? Joined a monastery? Done a terrible remake of Dil Se?
Quote from: Blackout on February 04, 2014, 06:52:12 AM
Regarding addiction, it most often trumps all of our basic needs including concern for family, friends, etc. It's terribly sad.
Addiction of any kind can be devastating and it cares not who you are, what you do or how rich and famous you are. Particularly drug and alcohol addiction.
I ran state district felony criminal courts for many years and my wife has been a felony probation officer in those same courts for even longer. We have seen what addiction can do to people. Nice, affluent folks and what you'd call "terrible" folks. The results were the same.
One of our courthouse friends (an attorney) now has a pending drug possession charge in my wife's court. The police and ambulance were called to a cheap dive motel because he was passed out on the bed with hookers surrounded by needles and bags of dope. Sound like Hoffman's scene? He's a great guy and a very good defense attorney who (like was mentioned in a previous post) stopped making right turns and took a hard left.
He lost his wife, who knows if he sees his kids, will assuredly be put on some sort of probation by the State Bar (or have his license suspended) resulting in loss of income and has lost many good friends who grew tired of trying to help. Again, he's a good guy that addiction has dragged into the abyss. Our prayers are with him and his family. Thank God he wasn't found dead of an overdose. At least he has a chance with the right court ordered help. Probably in a lock down facility for an extended period of time. And even that is no guarantee. It never is.
So unless you (or a friend/loved one) has been an addict please do not throw rocks at those that are or those that have been. Therefore but for the grace of God go I.
^Fastwin, I have been a social worker with Child Protective Services for many years and have seen many people lose relationships, children, jobs, housing, their freedom and ultimately their lives as a result. The addiction takes over part of the brain that makes decisions and cries out to be fed. It sucks for them and everyone who loves them.
Reports are that this may have been a part of a batch that was mixed with Morphine. If so, he is not the first to die from it or probably even the last. I watched drug addiction put several friends in the hospital, jails or graves over the years.
Scary stuff that.
Quote from: fastwin on February 04, 2014, 08:31:17 AM
Addiction of any kind can be devastating and it cares not who you are, what you do or how rich and famous you are. Particularly drug and alcohol addiction.
I ran state district felony criminal courts for many years and my wife has been a felony probation officer in those same courts for even longer. We have seen what addiction can do to people. Nice, affluent folks and what you'd call "terrible" folks. The results were the same.
One of our courthouse friends (an attorney) now has a pending drug possession charge in my wife's court. The police and ambulance were called to a cheap dive motel because he was passed out on the bed with hookers surrounded by needles and bags of dope. Sound like Hoffman's scene? He's a great guy and a very good defense attorney who (like was mentioned in a previous post) stopped making right turns and took a hard left.
He lost his wife, who knows if he sees his kids, will assuredly be put on some sort of probation by the State Bar (or have his license suspended) resulting in loss of income and has lost many good friends who grew tired of trying to help. Again, he's a good guy that addiction has dragged into the abyss. Our prayers are with him and his family. Thank God he wasn't found dead of an overdose. At least he has a chance with the right court ordered help. Probably in a lock down facility for an extended period of time. And even that is no guarantee. It never is.
So unless you (or a friend/loved one) has been an addict please do not throw rocks at those that are or those that have been. Therefore but for the grace of God go I.
This.
A required read: The Heroin Diaries by Nikki Sixx
http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2013/mar/09/russell-brand-life-without-drugs (http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2013/mar/09/russell-brand-life-without-drugs)
It is 10 years since I used drugs or drank alcohol and my life has improved immeasurably. I have a job, a house, a cat, good friendships and generally a bright outlook.
The price of this is constant vigilance because the disease of addiction is not rational.
...
Drugs and alcohol are not my problem, reality is my problem, drugs and alcohol are my solution.
If this seems odd to you it is because you are not an alcoholic or a drug addict. You are likely one of the 90% of people who can drink and use drugs safely. I have friends who can smoke weed, swill gin, even do crack and then merrily get on with their lives. For me, this is not an option. I will relinquish all else to ride that buzz to oblivion. Even if it began as a timid glass of chardonnay on a ponce's yacht, it would end with me necking the bottle, swimming to shore and sprinting to Bethnal Green in search of a crack house.
Exactly. Therein lies the problem with addiction. Like any disease it can affect one person and pass over the next 20 in line before it strikes again. As Russell Brand stated above in derby's post, his friends can go nuts on drugs/booze and seemingly be fine but just a drink can completely torpedo his personal life.
Problem #2 is that it's always lurking and waiting to strike again. Some folks have the mental strength to get over their addiction, say alcohol, then later in life find a way to control it. They can moderately drink in a social setting and be OK for example. More power to them, they are the few. I am no expert by any means, but I have seen the problems of addiction in my family and my wife and I have seen it daily in our professional lives.
The human mind is a wonderful, amazing thing but it also has many design flaws. Dealing with addictions and the havoc it can wreak on rational thinking is not one of its' best qualities.
Sadly Hoffman's story will never be the last of it's kind.
Quote from: bobspapa on February 04, 2014, 06:21:16 AM
maybe it's just me....but I would think having children would be enough of a reason to want to stay sober.
It's just you.
Once addiction has taken hold, nothing else matters than getting high. Your life is consumed by the substance you are addicted to. Even when you have that substance, you think about running out, so you are already panicking about the next high even though you are high. Children. Families. Job. None of that matters. I know it is a hard concept to follow or understand if you aren't a recovering substance abuser. You will never understand it.
Addicts do understand it and we can't explain it more than I just did.
Quote from: red baron on February 02, 2014, 01:33:32 PM
sadly another junkie
Nice. [roll]
Addicts are people too and they are very sick. They don't deserve to be called "junkies" by someone typing behind a faceless name.
Quote from: Cody on February 08, 2014, 11:01:52 AM
Nice. [roll]
Addicts are people too and they are very sick. They don't deserve to be called "junkies" by someone typing behind a faceless name.
Very sick is cancer. Heroin is poor choice after poor choice after poor choice.
Quote from: Cody on February 08, 2014, 11:00:31 AM
It's just you.
Once addiction has taken hold, nothing else matters than getting high. Your life is consumed by the substance you are addicted to. Even when you have that substance, you think about running out, so you are already panicking about the next high even though you are high. Children. Families. Job. None of that matters. I know it is a hard concept to follow or understand if you aren't a recovering substance abuser. You will never understand it.
Addicts do understand it and we can't explain it more than I just did.
[clap] [thumbsup]
Quote from: hbliam on February 08, 2014, 12:40:40 PM
Very sick is cancer. Heroin is poor choice after poor choice after poor choice.
[roll] [roll]
Sounds like you have a good understanding of addiction.
Quote from: hbliam on February 08, 2014, 12:40:40 PM
Very sick is cancer. Heroin is poor choice after poor choice after poor choice.
That's an impressively arrogant and ignorant statement. There are many circumstances involved. Many addicts have comorbodities, including other mental illnesses. Or are you saying that mental illness is something one can simply "decide" his way out of?
Quote from: hbliam on February 08, 2014, 12:40:40 PM
Very sick is cancer. Heroin is poor choice after poor choice after poor choice.
I'm never sure (in many of his posts) if he's trolling or serious.
So you guys think there could be a reason for "poor choice after poor choice after poor choice"? I agree. Also, some straighten out without help, some don't. Sometimes it is not good to be judgmental and better to show some compassion instead. RIP Phillip Seymour Hoffman.
Quote from: Cody on February 09, 2014, 07:09:22 AM
[roll] [roll]
Sounds like you have a good understanding of addiction.
I've interviewed hundreds of addicts. Every one of them chose to take drugs.
Everything in life is choices.
My point is, in my opinion, people that are "very sick" are those that have no choice in the matter. No options, very little hope or no hope, no real choices. Addicts still have all three.
Quote from: swampduc on February 09, 2014, 03:00:18 PM
That's an impressively arrogant and ignorant statement. There are many circumstances involved. Many addicts have comorbodities, including other mental illnesses. Or are you saying that mental illness is something one can simply "decide" his way out of?
I don't see anywhere that I said anything about mental illness.
"People with an addiction do not have control over what they are doing, taking or using. Their addiction may reach a point at which it is harmful. Addictions do not only include physical things we consume, such as drugs or alcohol, but may include virtually anything, such abstract things as gambling to seemingly harmless products, such as chocolate - in other words, addiction may refer to a substance dependence (e.g. drug addiction) or behavioral addiction (e.g. gambling addiction)."
Quote from: Ducatamount on February 09, 2014, 03:31:50 PM
I'm never sure (in many of his posts) if he's trolling or serious.
I'm not eloquent and I apologize for that. I'm just stating my experiences.
Quote from: kopfjäger on February 09, 2014, 03:50:34 PM
"People with an addiction do not have control over what they are doing, taking or using. Their addiction may reach a point at which it is harmful. Addictions do not only include physical things we consume, such as drugs or alcohol, but may include virtually anything, such abstract things as gambling to seemingly harmless products, such as chocolate - in other words, addiction may refer to a substance dependence (e.g. drug addiction) or behavioral addiction (e.g. gambling addiction)."
It's much easier to be empathetic to those that are addicted to say alcohol or even prescription drugs. Things that are innocently taken or thought of as harmless. It's much harder to be empathetic toward those that know full well that the illegal dope they scored is highly addictive and even infamous for destroying nearly all that partake.
I get what hbliam is saying. It's impossible to be a heroin addict if you've never tried it. The initial exposure was a choice, and a bad one.
I've tried a few drugs...but most I chose to just stay away from as they seem too dangerous.
Quote from: hbliam on February 09, 2014, 04:00:29 PM
It's much easier to be empathetic to those that are addicted to say alcohol or even prescription drugs. Things that are innocently taken or thought of as harmless. It's much harder to be empathetic toward those that know full well that the illegal dope they scored is highly addictive and even infamous for destroying nearly all that partake.
From 'Clean' by David Sheff
"I guess it's this very deeply ingrained idea that addicts are choosing to get high and so they are reprehensible and they're weak. But what we know now is that addicts aren't immoral, they aren't weak; they're ill. They have a disease. And for me, when I finally realized that about Nic, that he was sick, and that's what explained this unconscionable, crazy behavior, it allowed me to look at him with compassion, and to figure out, instead of with anger, just, how do I help him? How do we save his life?"
Quote from: hbliam on February 09, 2014, 04:00:29 PM
It's much easier to be empathetic to those that are addicted to say alcohol or even prescription drugs. Things that are innocently taken or thought of as harmless. It's much harder to be empathetic toward those that know full well that the illegal dope they scored is highly addictive and even infamous for destroying nearly all that partake.
You just don't get it.
Do you think most heroin addicts woke up one day and decided to put a needle in their arm? No.
Heroin addicts typically were addicted to prescription pain medication prior to "scoring dope."
I wouldn't expect you to understand the transgression from being addicted to pain killers to moving to something much cheaper.
Quote from: Cody on February 09, 2014, 04:48:37 PM
You just don't get it.
Do you think most heroin addicts woke up one day and decided to put a needle in their arm? No.
Heroin addicts typically were addicted to prescription pain medication prior to "scoring dope."
I wouldn't expect you to understand the transgression from being addicted to pain killers to moving to something much cheaper.
Of the addicts I have met, I can't remember a single one that said they started with prescribed drugs. They started with cigarettes and marijuana. Then progressed to meth, crack, and heroin.
Wow.
This one is getting ugly.
Can you guys take the debates to PMs?
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa91/chiflado/e12b9b8cb3aed4b1e2628b8282c85841.jpg)
Quote from: hbliam on February 09, 2014, 05:06:42 PM
Of the addicts I have met, I can't remember a single one that said they started with prescribed drugs. They started with cigarettes and marijuana. Then progressed to meth, crack, and heroin.
I find that hard to believe. Luckily, I never did heroin. I had a drug dealer that was easy to visit. He was known as my pain management doctor. I would go visit him twice a month and my insurance would pay for my pills. I could blame my doctor for me becoming an addict, but that isn't right and certainly wasn't the case. I kept going back because I was addicted. If I wouldn't have had my doctor, no telling what would have happened to me. I very well could have switched to heroin.
I think it's time to let Mr. Hoffman rest in peace and to stop sniping at each other.