Quote from: Randimus Maximus on March 19, 2012, 06:31:31 AM
<snip>
5) Do some research on the recalls before you just spew soundbites.  Recalls make cars safer.  

 

...but...but...

rumor and innuendo are so much more exciting.

I got a few things wrong, it's ok.

My comment wasn't to say that Toyotas are shit, they aren't, they have a good reputation for good reason.  My Celica would have gone another 200k miles easily and the body was in great shape.

I thought NUMMI built Camrys as well but I read that incorrectly.  It was the Matrix I was thinking of with QA issues.

Your friend with the Optima is unique, perhaps he was offroading it?  My wife's mother bought the new Optima on my recommendation and a year later she's still thrilled with it.  We have 32k miles into this Sorento and still would buy it again and my wife puts 50 miles/day on it commuting to work. 

Toyota tried to be the biggest car company but the price was that they ended up with crappy styling on several models (Rav4 for one) and killing some people on the other.  That's what happens when you over extend.

Wait, you work at Toyota?  Well of course you're going to pump them up, my friend!  That Kia Optima would have to give you a massage and a handjob and get 400 mpg (on water) before you'd give it marks over the Camry!  :-)

Recalls do make cars safer but are necessary due to QA problems in design and manufacturing. I'd prefer (we'd all prefer) a car that doesn't need recalls, but of course that's not realistic, so the fewer recalls, the better.

Quote from: Randimus Maximus on March 19, 2012, 06:31:31 AM
I'm not sure where you are getting your information, but you are completely off the mark regarding Toyota's manufacturing here in the states.

1) Camrys were never built at NUMMI.  That defunct joint venture with GM built Corollas and Tacomas.

2) All Camrys sold in the US are built in the US, with the highest domestic parts content (per Cars.com). The majority are built in Georgetown, KY at TMMK, wholly owned by Toyota.  The balance are built in Lafayette, IN at SIA (Subaru) of which Toyota has a 17% stake in Fuji Heavy Industries (Subaru's parent company).

3) I've driven the new Camry vs a Sonata, Altima, Fusion, Malibu, Accord and Legacy.  None of them can touch it, in any aspect.  A good friend of mine bought a Kia Optima last summer.  I saw him in November.  The car had 7,400 miles on it and was already falling apart.

4) About 70% (and climbing) of the Toyotas sold in NA are manufactured here.  That will continue to rise as our newest plant in MS adds capacity for Corolla as it ramps up.  The second newest plant opened in '08.

5) Do some research on the recalls before you just spew soundbites.  Recalls make cars safer. 

I'll quote our global president (Akio Toyoda) from a meeting I saw him at last fall, "Anyone who underestimates Toyota, does so at their own peril." 

See comments in red.

Quote from: ducatiz on March 19, 2012, 06:50:10 AM
I thought NUMMI built Camrys as well but I read that incorrectly.  It was the Matrix I was thinking of with QA issues. Matrix were never built at NUMMI either.  And please clue me in on it's QA issues.

Your friend with the Optima is unique, perhaps he was offroading it?  My wife's mother bought the new Optima on my recommendation and a year later she's still thrilled with it.  We have 32k miles into this Sorento and still would buy it again and my wife puts 50 miles/day on it commuting to work.  No off-roading.  Only a 40 mile one-way commute to work

Toyota tried to be the biggest car company but the price was that they ended up with crappy styling on several models (Rav4 for one) and killing some people on the other.  That's what happens when you over extend.  Styling is subjective, my friend.  I have no issues with the styling of the current RAV4 (of course, I am a fan boy)  

Wait, you work at Toyota?  Well of course you're going to pump them up, my friend!  That Kia Optima would have to give you a massage and a handjob and get 400 mpg (on water) before you'd give it marks over the Camry!  :-)  As I said, I've driven the Camry's competitors back to back to back.  Fan boy says Camry wins!  Of course, the general public must agree as Camry was #1 in passenger car sales last year and is leading the pack so far this year

Quote from: Randimus Maximus on March 19, 2012, 07:00:35 AM
See comments in red.

everything is subjective.  Camrys are popular in America for the same reason that Whirlpool dryers are -- they are inoffensive, and cheap for the base model.  for the same money, you get a ton more features in a Hyundai or Kia, and the Kia has much better styling.

I honestly don't care that much about Toyota or Hyundai, but I have been very impressed with Hyundai's efforts lately and not at all impressed with Toyotas.  They make very good engines, but their styling has been crap for a long time, which is I think a result of them trying to be Buick (Venza anyone?    )

when they go back to making cars like the 2000GT, I'll reconsider owning one.

I don't follow the car mags as much as I used to.  Maybe it's just because I hear "Toyota recall of 500,000 vehicles" on the radio every few weeks.  The NUMMI plant had QA problems, which is why they shut it down, I'll have to google to see what was made there for Toyota, but if you say Corollas, Coronas, and Tercels and cheap Hiluxes, and I'll go with that. 

Here is the Toyota I used to lust for



here's the one I had (same color too)

I've rented the sonata and genesis.  I'll say that the genesis feels a lot like the 5 series Beemer. Each week I rent a car I look for one, fully loaded of course.   . 
I'm very impressed with them. 

The Genesis Coupe falls right into the sport car category.  RWD with almost 350hp.  It's a fun car.

That is a nice car drove one. But I am eagerly waiting for 2013 Toyota Avalon Hybrid. 

Quote from: ducatiz on March 19, 2012, 07:16:24 AM
everything is subjective.  Camrys are popular in America for the same reason that Whirlpool dryers are -- they are inoffensive, and cheap for the base model.  for the same money, you get a ton more features in a Hyundai or Kia, and the Kia has much better styling.

I honestly don't care that much about Toyota or Hyundai, but I have been very impressed with Hyundai's efforts lately and not at all impressed with Toyotas.  They make very good engines, but their styling has been crap for a long time, which is I think a result of them trying to be Buick (Venza anyone?   )

when they go back to making cars like the 2000GT, I'll reconsider owning one.

I don't follow the car mags as much as I used to.  Maybe it's just because I hear "Toyota recall of 500,000 vehicles" on the radio every few weeks.  The NUMMI plant had QA problems, which is why they shut it down, I'll have to google to see what was made there for Toyota, but if you say Corollas, Coronas, and Tercels and cheap Hiluxes, and I'll go with that.  

While you may not follow the car mags, the sound bites you hear have you posting mis-information about NUMMI once again.

At the end, NUMMI built Corollas, Tacomas & the Pontiac Vibe.  It previously built Chevrolet Novas, Geo Prizms, Toyota Hilux & the Toyota Voltz (for export to Japan).

NUMMI wasn't closed due to any QA issues.  GM suspended production there in 2009 when Pontiac went away, and then decided to walk away from the plant as part of it's restructuring.  Toyota, being only a 50% owner, decided to then close the plant as it had excess truck capacity in Texas and a brand new, yet empty, plant in Mississippi.  Tacoma went to Texas, Corolla is now built in Mississippi.  Toyota provided about $250M to the 4,700 workers at NUMMI left without a job.  GM paid $0.

If you liked the 2000GT (and who wouldn't??), check out the Scion FR-S when it hits showrooms this summer.  I'm betting there will be something sporty and a little more upmarket with a Toyota badge on it sometime in the future.

Quote from: 99Zulu on March 19, 2012, 11:34:08 AM
That is a nice car drove one. But I am eagerly waiting for 2013 Toyota Avalon Hybrid.  

The next Avalon will surprise a lot of people.

But back to Hyundai.

And recalls.

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/03/19/hyundai-to-petition-nhtsa-over-2011-2012-sonata-hybrid-seatbelt/

On the surface, this doesn't sound bad.  About 14K Sonata Hybrids involved over a two-year time span.  

The problem is related to the rear seat center seat belt not meeting safety standards.  Oops.

Hyundai is fixing the units unsold on dealer lots (about 1,600 cars).  They are petitioning the gov't not to fix the 13K or so that are already sold because, "it believes the action is "inconsequential as it relates to motor vehicle safety.""  Way to step up, Hyundai!  

I'm not going to get into this brand vs that, but:

If Hyundai and Kia would bring some of their other sportier models it keeps in country (South Korea) and exports to Singapore and Hong Kong to the states, it would be a lot more interesting.

Going to these countries over the past couple years and seeing what they get makes me understand why they are still not "loved" in the states...

Quote from: Randimus Maximus on March 19, 2012, 02:58:51 PM
If you liked the 2000GT (and who wouldn't??), check out the Scion FR-S when it hits showrooms this summer.  I'm betting there will be something sporty and a little more upmarket with a Toyota badge on it sometime in the future.

I think the Subaru version of the car will top the Toyota/Scion version...

Quote from: zooom on March 19, 2012, 05:30:39 PM
I think the Subaru version of the car will top the Toyota/Scion version...

you just want to see his head turn red don't you? 

Quote from: kupcaker on March 18, 2012, 09:21:50 PM
http://www.hyundaiusa.com/vehicles/2012/equus/

JUST LOOK WHAT YOU STARTED!!!!

Quote from: WarrenJ on March 19, 2012, 05:44:58 PM
JUST LOOK WHAT YOU STARTED!!!!

2012 Hyundai Equus at 2012 Toronto Auto Show - Canadian International AutoShow CIA

Quote from: zooom on March 19, 2012, 05:30:39 PM
I think the Subaru version of the car will top the Toyota/Scion version...

Performance wise, the cars are identical.

However, the Subie version will come in two grades and will be more expensive than the Scion version.

Oh, and I get to drive the FR-S in three weeks. 

Genesis Coupe 2-Step launch