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Started by Bick, July 06, 2013, 01:49:23 PM

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hbliam

#15
July 07, 2013, 08:21:44 PM
Correction: Now they are reporting the pilot was training on the 777 and that was his first (and likely last) landing at SFO in a 777.

I know the airline already had the checkbook out but sounds like they better start adding zeros to everyone's checks.

kopfjäger

#16
July 07, 2013, 08:28:28 PM
Quote from: hbliam on July 07, 2013, 08:21:44 PM
Correction: Now they are reporting the pilot was training on the 777 and that was his first (and likely last) landing at SFO in a 777.

I know the airline already had the checkbook out but sounds like they better start adding zeros to everyone's checks.

He wasn't alone on the flight deck. The Captain is at fault as well.
“Woohoohoohoo! Two personal records! For breath holding and number of sharks shot in the frickin\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

hbliam

#17
July 07, 2013, 09:31:52 PM Last Edit: July 07, 2013, 10:00:03 PM by hbliam
Quote from: kopfjäger on July 07, 2013, 08:28:28 PM
He wasn't alone on the flight deck. The Captain is at fault as well.

Of course. But it just makes everything worse that the guy that crashed the plane wasn't the most experienced guy on the flight deck.

kopfjäger

#18
July 07, 2013, 09:48:35 PM
Quote from: hbliam on July 07, 2013, 09:31:52 PM
Of course. But it just make everything worse that the guy that crashed the plane wasn't the most experienced guy on the flight deck.

True, but.....
“Woohoohoohoo! Two personal records! For breath holding and number of sharks shot in the frickin\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

ungeheuer

#19
July 07, 2013, 10:06:00 PM
Hmmm... so if it's beginning to sound like pilot error.....

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muskrat

#20
July 07, 2013, 11:14:58 PM
40 hours on the 777 but according to Asiana he had more than 10,000 hours which included the 747.  This has all the writings of pilot(s) error, there were 4 on hand.
Can we thin the gene pool? 

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kopfjäger

#21
July 07, 2013, 11:26:22 PM
Quote from: muskrat on July 07, 2013, 11:14:58 PM
40 hours on the 777 but according to Asiana he had more than 10,000 hours which included the 747.  This has all the writings of pilot(s) error, there were 4 on hand.

My point as why the Captain is responsible.
“Woohoohoohoo! Two personal records! For breath holding and number of sharks shot in the frickin\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

Triple J

#22
July 08, 2013, 01:17:43 PM
Reporting now that the plane was only going about 103 knots, instead of the required 137.

Seems odd. New to the 777 or not, the pilot had a lot of time on other passenger jets where this should have been an obvious problem. I'm wondering if there was a faulty airspeed indicator, and they didn't realize it until it was too late and the plane started giving the stall warnings.  ???

Speeddog

#23
July 08, 2013, 01:43:12 PM
Pilot in the seat had minimal hours in 777.
Instructor had lots of hours in 777, but this was first time as 777 instructor.
I suspect it'll come out that they were both due for rest, or overdue.
Usually it's a long string of errors necessary to deck a plane.

Something said it was SOP to fly the 777 approach on auto-throttle down to 500 ft, and then the pilot takes over manual throttle.

103 knots?
A little googling found that published stall speed is 106.
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Skybarney

#24
July 08, 2013, 06:18:44 PM
The reality is that until the NTSB finished it's investigation anything and everything is nothing but guesses.  My guess is pilot error.  That being said there are IMO four pilots out there that are done with commercial aviation. 
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MadDuck

#25
July 08, 2013, 11:11:04 PM
Quote from: kopfjäger on July 06, 2013, 08:16:30 PM
From the debris field it had to have hit tail first. Bad ass airplane. I can't wait to here the 'crews' stories.

Boeing has always built badass, tough aircraft.  This seems like pilot error.
No modification goes unpunished. Memento mori.  Good people drink good beer.  Things happen pretty fast at high speeds.

It's all up to your will level, your thrill level and your skill level.  Everything else is just fluff.

muskrat

#26
July 10, 2013, 12:19:53 PM
Quote from: Triple J on July 08, 2013, 01:17:43 PM
Reporting now that the plane was only going about 103 knots, instead of the required 137.

Seems odd. New to the 777 or not, the pilot had a lot of time on other passenger jets where this should have been an obvious problem. I'm wondering if there was a faulty airspeed indicator, and they didn't realize it until it was too late and the plane started giving the stall warnings.  ???
Altimeter would have told them their approach was too low so I'd think that airspeed indicator or not it was a host of errors not the least of which seems to be pointing to human error. 
Can we thin the gene pool? 

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ungeheuer

#27
July 10, 2013, 06:18:28 PM Last Edit: July 10, 2013, 06:22:27 PM by ungeheuer
Look, it may or may not have any bearing.... but....

"None of the four pilots on Asiana Flight 214 was tested for drugs or alcohol after the jet crashed in San Francisco..."

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/drug_tests_skipped_jLrnogUD4D9k8zL7BvsJfL

Really???  That's absomake the beast with two backsinglutely unmake the beast with two backsingbelievable!!!!!  

I wouldn't get to walk away from a road traffic collision without such tests....

Really??  WTF??  [bang]

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Triple J

#28
July 10, 2013, 06:21:27 PM
Quote from: muskrat on July 10, 2013, 12:19:53 PM
Altimeter would have told them their approach was too low so I'd think that airspeed indicator or not it was a host of errors not the least of which seems to be pointing to human error. 

Agreed

Obviously speculation on my part. Just seems like an awful basic error.

the_Journeyman

#29
July 10, 2013, 07:04:25 PM
Quote from: ungeheuer on July 10, 2013, 06:18:28 PM
I wouldn't get to walk away from a road traffic collision without such tests....

I understand.  A driver of a stopped school bus (lights and all) got rear-ended) in my county and that was the first thing the investigating officer asked for. A drug/alcohol test on the driver...  Makes no sense,  Same thing here. 

I do however thing fatigue and inexperience may be the largest contributing factors here unless there were some gross instrument readings that made everything look ok on approach.

JM
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