Snap-On does indeed make nice stuff.

But, I find it impossible in nearly every case to justify the astronomic price.
Really, $33 vs. $7-8 for a 12mm 12-point combination wrench?

https://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=&item_ID=633160&group_ID=674993&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog
https://www.napaonline.com/p/CHQCWFP112M
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-12mm-wrench-12-pt-combination/p-00942916000P?intcmp=crft-pdp-buy-cta

The only Snap-On tools I have are oddball, specific-use things. All of which I've bought used.

Unless I was a professional wrench there's no way in hell I could justify the cost of their stuff.

I was a professional wrench for about 10 years. You do indeed have to be making money with them. As far as hand tools go like the wrenches and sockets I find craftsman to be just fine but I always use the Snap on or Mac ratchets now. I pretty much have everything I need at this point (Except a garage) Although I do need a new 1/4" Torx bit set because the one I have is Chinesium and, well...you know.

So Napa eh? Napa is always around. I think I have a couple of larger wrenches around from Napa.


Snap on is the Mary Kay for men.  

Looks like most of the members posting on this thread have already enough tools, and have been wrenching for quite some time.
(On the other hand, I don’t see any posts made by the members who are just about to start buying tools.)

Those who are contributing to the thread already know this,I suppose, but in case some beginners reading this thread, I will say this.
Don’t buy a big set (like 300 pieces set) from the retail store (that includes Sears(Craftsman), Home Depot (Husky), Lowes (Kobalt), etc.)
You are not getting a good deal. You have to remember, those sets are designed by marketing people, to make you believe you are getting a good deal. Those marketing people don’t wrench on cars and motorcycles. They don’t know what it’s like to get bloody knuckles when the wrench slips or the ratchet brakes off. Or, what tools you actually use and what tools you never use.

Rather than trying to get a good deal, buy quality tools one by one, as needed.

When you buy $30 wrench, it still is expensive, but you are only spending $30 for now. You may spend another $30 in next month, or two months later.
Buying used, quality tool is also a good idea.

There are certain jobs you will do over and over again, such as oil change, brake bleeding, etc.
Tools for those tasks, I would recommend buying the best one you can afford.

I actually broke the rule you just stated last year. I bought one of the big Craftsman sets but it was only because they were closing that Sears and it was hugely marked down.
My tools are a wide mix of stuff otherwise, only a few Snap On that to be honest, I don't even know where they came from 

QuoteI actually broke the rule you just stated last year

Nothing is wrong here. You probably know what you are getting, know the cost : value (of the tools) ratio, then decided to buy.
They can be useful for back up, beater set, etc.

I said it in case some newbies actually thinking they can get a truly useful tool set, saving a big $$$ by going that way.



About the wrenches.
Basically, “you get what you pay for” rule applies here.
It doesn’t mean you have to buy Snap-On. But, there’s a reason why some people prefer SO or other high end wrenches.
Take a look at this pic.

DSC01738

(From top to bottom,
Craftsman raised panel (USA made, old one)
Gearwrench 1st. gen. (Taiwan)

Kobalt (Discontinued, Taiwan)

NAPA Carlyle (Taiwan)

Craftsman Professional (made by S.K. for Sears, USA, discontinued)

Snap-On double boxed end XOM1214 (USA)

Snap-On OEXLM12B (USA)

They are all 12 mm. (XOM1214 is 12mm - 14mm double box end, and NAPA Carlyle is 7/16 since I don’t have their metric wrenches).
Notice Snap On combination is almost 40% longer than Craftsman RP ?

When things gets harder, this makes HUGE difference. (In other words, if you don’t confront stubborn / half damaged fastener, you really don’t need it.)

There’s a reason Craftsman can not make their wrenchs that long.

The material isn’t strong enough to take the force (crated by extra leverage).
The jaw and box end don’t give enough grip, the wrench will slip off at the worst moment. (= bloody knuckle).

Yes, with Craftsman,you can use double wrench technique, or you can use mallet on the wrench, but if you can do the job with just one wrench, that’s a  lot better.

By the way, some wrenches come in short, standard, long pattern.
Snap-On’s “standard” is equivalent to other brand’s “long”,  SO’s  “long”  would be  “super long”  in other brand’s standard.
You can find those super long pattern wrenches from MAC, Matco, Williams, Cornwell, Armstrong, also.

(Craftsman Professional wrenches were really, really good value. They were essentially S.K. long pattern wrenches with Craftsman brand’s availability and warranty, with very affordable price tag. Sadly, they are no longer available. If you find them at garage sale or local CL at reasonable price, get them.

Those Taiwan made Kobalt wrenches were nicer than current version. To be honest, they were better wrenches than Craftsman Raised Panel, but they were not something you would develop mental attachment.

Ratcheting wrench from Gearwrench, they are only useful in certain situations. So, ... most of the time, they are kinda useless.)

Then, look at the boxed end, from the side.

DSC01744


From left to right,
Snap On XOM1214, Snap On OEXLM12B, Carlyle, Craftsman, Gearwrench
(I didn’t photographed  Kobalt and Craftsman Professional because they are no longer available.)

You can see Gearwrenches gigantic head. Don’t waste your money on the set of these wrenches. Buy a sockets and ratchet, instead.

For the nowbies, I actually recommend double boxed end wrenches rather than combination wrenches, for many reasons.
You will need fewer wrenches, they are more stable when applying force (note, the handle is “offset”, NOT “angled” like combination wrenches).

And the last photo.

DSC01745
This is a close up photo of Snap-On and Craftsman.
This is why Snap-On wrenches and socket can loosen the stubborn fastener that Craftsman will end up rounding off.

Flank drive is one thing.

But, more importantly, Craftsman wrenches and sockets have this massive chamfering.

Look at the photo closely.
This is 70 - 80 % of the reason they fail on low profile bolt and nuts, partially rounded bolt head, etc.
SImply, they don’t give the same level of grip of high end tools.

Quote from: S21FOLGORE on January 08, 2017, 01:56:02 PM
There’s a reason Craftsman can not make their wrenchs that long.

The material isn’t strong enough to take the force (crated by extra leverage).
The jaw and box end don’t give enough grip, the wrench will slip off at the worst moment. (= bloody knuckle)

How long is that Snap-On double boxed end XOM1214 (USA)?

I'd like to compare it with my 12/14 double box Craftsman.

XOM series is standard handle, deep (60°) offset. XOM1214’s overall length is 210 mm.
XBM series is 10° offset, and 230mm.

The long pattern wrenches are
XDHFM1214 (0° offset) 298mm
XDHM1214 (15° offset) 290mm

All this talk of stocking a shop, not one mention of alcohol.


Priorities, people.

Well, I brew beer in my shop, but we were talking about tools.... 

Quote from: Speedbag on January 09, 2017, 08:07:26 AM
Well, I brew beer in my shop, but we were talking about tools.... 

It is a tool. How else do you clean a bloody knuckle but with alcohol? What if the repair fiss badly, a part gets lost, etc? Its time for jack daniels to repair them feelings of frustration.

Quote from: Satellite smithy on January 09, 2017, 08:10:39 AM
It is a tool. How else do you clean a bloody knuckle but with alcohol? What if the repair fiss badly, a part gets lost, etc? Its time for jack daniels to repair them feelings of frustration.

Further proof you got soft. Blood isn't to be cleaned, a significant amount should be coating the vehicle to imbue it with speed.

You guys are doing it wrong. Get your hands out of the situation by using extensions and / or gloves.

Back to the original topic, an interesting tidbit about Stanley...

They already own Bostitch, Irwin (the makers of the original Vice Grips), Lenox, and Mac.

Irwin is just the company that bought the vise-grip company.

http://livinghistoryfarm.org/farminginthe40s/machines_12.html

IIRC Stanley also owns Black & Decker, Dewalt and Porter Cable.