i think everything mat says is a matter of [in my opinion] + [this is the best way to do X].  the results don't argue with that.. but it of course doesn't make anything the end-all, be-all on such a subjective topic.

i mean... look at the jacked up body positions of doohan, corser, and bayliss.  they still managed to win. 

I agree with tufty; I noticed a difference between Spencer and Schwantz coaching, and Schwantz was more upright.  I think Freddie's curriculum was highly influenced by his coaching staff (personal opinion), but I'm not sure about Schwantz.

Agreed, body position isn't everything but that doesn't refute the general point at all.

If you can imagine someone going to the Elias track riding school and trying to learn with his body position, maybe you'll get the point. Body position is a continuum (John Mayer, great album) there are people who drag elbows (elbowz!) and are crazy quick, there are people who are practically draggy ass and crazy quick. Does that mean that when you're teaching people it doesn't matter? No, not at all. When teaching, you want to make people as comfortable as possible so that they're going to be able to take on the concepts attempting to be learned.

For example, Lee Parks focuses on left hand turns because most people are more comfortable turning left. It would be more difficult to teach people something like trail braking if you try to do that when they're uncomfortable.

For us normal people (lol!), getting a body position that's comfortable is *way* more important than having the "perfect form" (whatever that is). That's the point that I extrapolate from Mladin's comments.

Quote from: EvilSteve on March 03, 2010, 07:39:40 AM
Mladin is an amazing rider, super fast but a bit of a douche, I think it's funny, you don't like it, can we just take it as read that you're not a fan and move on?

Can I save this quote next time you're bashing the hell out of most Brit riders? (Yeah, you really do.)

Quote from: EvilSteve on March 03, 2010, 10:25:27 AM
For us normal people (lol!), getting a body position that's comfortable is *way* more important than having the "perfect form" (whatever that is). That's the point that I extrapolate from Mladin's comments.

i think he thinks there's one way to do it, period.  but i agree with you.. i'm pretty sure i get a lot more off the bike than css 'taught' me to.  not something i tried to do, just happened.

Quote from: gm2 on March 03, 2010, 10:46:14 AM
i think he thinks there's one way to do it, period.  but i agree with you.. i'm pretty sure i get a lot more off the bike than css 'taught' me to.  not something i tried to do, just happened.

naaah.

Similarly to the heroic photo above,   , gm2 and Spies don't seem to hang off the bike excessively, there is a lot of lean angle to the bike and their torsos are inside the tank which gives the appearance of being way off the bike.

I am newly converted to the Matt Mladin school of riding, where the knee never touches the ground!!

Yeah, I can see where if you're focused so much on hanging off the bike, you could lose perspective on other important facets of riding. And isn't it all about maximizing the contact patch of the tire with the pavement at a given speed and lean angle? Could it be that newer tire technology obviates the need to lean off so much?

I think we should go back to calling Mladin a douche.

Quote from: duccarlos on March 04, 2010, 04:35:47 AM
I think we should go back to calling Mladin a douche.

me too...

Mat Mladin-> You're a douche!

I finally got a chance to watch some more of those videos last night, and I have some questions:

• Regarding those "midgets" in Europe that can't handle a 200hp superbike: Capirossi didn't seem to have trouble with a 250hp Ducati at Mugello, and Pedrosa has finished ahead of Rossi on several occasions.  Thoughts?
• Backing it in isn't the fastest way around a track: did Hayden back it in when he beat Mladin for the title?  Rossi has also been known to back a bike in.
• Hanging off isn't the fastest style: his example is Rossi, but my counter-example is Stoner, who is arguably faster than Rossi.  Is he just an exception?

The video series would be complete if he'd offer his opinions on counter-steering, trail-braking, the rear brake, and the best oil to use  

Quote from: tufty on March 03, 2010, 10:36:11 AMCan I save this quote next time you're bashing the hell out of most Brit riders? (Yeah, you really do.)

I rag on Toseland because I'm genuinely not a fan but not on every mention of his name... stupid Toseland. I'm actually thinking of the Family Guy episode now where Peter makes a noise every time someone says Meg's name. This one: http://www.trilulilu.ro/Sevy/07478fe5cb47d6#video-h370

The main issue I have with the Brits is the commentator who always focuses on the English riders even when they're amazingly riding in 9th. I like Rea, Byrne, et. al. but if they're riding like cocks then you can expect me to say something.

Quote from: Cider on March 04, 2010, 05:14:00 AM

• Regarding those "midgets" in Europe that can't handle a 200hp superbike: Capirossi didn't seem to have trouble with a 250hp Ducati at Mugello, and Pedrosa has finished ahead of Rossi on several occasions.  Thoughts?
• Backing it in isn't the fastest way around a track: did Hayden back it in when he beat Mladin for the title?  Rossi has also been known to back a bike in.
• Hanging off isn't the fastest style: his example is Rossi, but my counter-example is Stoner, who is arguably faster than Rossi.  Is he just an exception?

1. His point is that the superbikes are harder to deal with because you have to muscle them around a lot more. They're heavier & turn slower.
2. Backing it in is the ultimate form of point & shoot IMO and is a little contradictory from other stuff he's said. I'm not good enough to argue the actual point though, especially when comparing how Mladin does it (nuts!) as compared to backing it in.
3. Different styles work for different people.

Quote from: Cider on March 04, 2010, 05:14:00 AM

• Backing it in isn't the fastest way around a track: did Hayden back it in when he beat Mladin for the title?  Rossi has also been known to back a bike in.

i can't remember how out of line nicky was that year, but tire tech has come a long way over the last 8 years and traction control has entered the equation.

fwiw, mladin can backup a most of these opinions on motorcycle control with hard data from ~2000-present.

Quote from: derby on March 04, 2010, 06:36:17 AM


fwiw, mladin can backup a most of these opinions on motorcycle control with hard data from ~2000-present.

For himself on X number of bikes over 10 years.  He, (or anyone else) can't back it up as a universal truth or a law of physics.  For every "fact" people say, there are always exceptions if you look enough.

mitt

pt. 12 preview... b/c i know that will annoy some ppl   
Mladin - Inside with the Champ Teaser, Episode 12