educational questions

[pipeliner1978]

thanks Chuck for the information, but why did Ducati "have to" and the others didn't, and I remember the recent R1, only flaw was it was yellow  

[pipeliner1978]

I think Ferrari "sells out", but you don't see them busting @ss to make more...

apples and oranges my good man

Ferrari is in a way higher class than Ducati

Pricing alone doesn't make these 2 comparable...............unless ofcourse if the cheapest Ducati sold was a d16rr

[bryant8]

Don't the twins require a higher state of tune in order to produce similar power to the I-4 bikes (on level cc displacement)?  I think that's why they produce(d) the "SP," "SPS," or "R" bikes.

So to satisfy consumer demos, they produce a stable, more reliable version of a bike for the masses, but for those that want the hot-rod version that can be found on the race tracks they produce those. (plus meet homologation rules)

I could be completely wrong...

[pipeliner1978]

you can buy both but the Ducati is much closer to the actual super bike

Which one is closer?


1098R $40000



1098 base $16000



2007 Suzuki GSXR1000 $13000




My only thing is, I don't think the the Ducati's are better, they are just apples to oranges.  I think a stock GSXR 1000 is a faster, more powerful bike (with way less maintenance!!!!) than the stock 1098.  My dream bike is a 1098R, but I believe if you have $40000 invested in a GSXR 1000, you got a bike capable of eating a 1098's lunch.....  I think unless you are racing and are able to completely tune your bike to you, then you are just buying it for sex appeal.  Or you are buying it because it's a twin (apple) vs a in-line 4 (orange), not because it's better. 

[pipeliner1978]

FYI, I bought mine cause it's pure sex 

[bryant8]

Or you could buy a 22hp Honda like Peter Lenz rides and school the crap out of literbikes on the track

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU6xrs7SOCc

[pipeliner1978]

Or you could buy a 22hp Honda like Peter Lenz rides and school the crap out of literbikes on the track

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU6xrs7SOCc

I cant view the video at work, but there is no doubt in my mind that there are people that read this forum that can take a 695 and run circles around me on my 1098s on the track.   

[bryant8]

I meant to add that dyno sheets are great and all, but don't tell what a bike can do.

Check that video out though when you get the chance.  This kid is amazing 

[pipeliner1978]

I meant to add that dyno sheets are great and all, but don't tell what a bike can do.

I know, that's why I think more people should test ride inline 4's
I love my 1098, I love my R1 and I really loved my GSXR 1000.........all wonderful bikes, but we all know know which is the fastest (and it aint the Duc)

[bryant8]

Right on, no arguement there.

Fastest in which situation is the question.   (sorta like the fastest color debate)

[Cyclone]

... Peter Lenz rides and school the crap out of literbikes on the track..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU6xrs7SOCc

WOW  - that's humbling to watch - child SBK Prodigy !

[pipeliner1978]

Right on, no arguement there.

Fastest in which situation is the question.   (sorta like the fastest color debate)

yeah, fastest from point a to point b, it's hard for any twin to dominate.  On the track.........Rossi or Stoner.....Spies or Mladin...I guess that would just depend on how good the rider is on which track etc....

and if we are talking fastest color, that just depends on the model of bike, 848 white! (sorry Kev) 1098 red/gold, inline 4 blue!

[Duc L'Smart]

WOW  - that's humbling to watch - child SBK Prodigy !

I quit.

[cdc]

thanks Chuck for the information, but why did Ducati "have to" and the others didn't, and I remember the recent R1, only flaw was it was yellow  

I don't think it is that they have to but that their business model allows them to and they want to.  If they "have" to it may be that they live and work in an environment that expects them to.  MV Agusta had the limited (300 bikes ) $50k+ "Oro Edition" F4 750cc when they first came back to market and currently have the $100K+ F4 1078cc limited edition (100 bikes) "CC".  Benelli also had a limited edition of the Tre' and there's Bimota, in a world of their own.

Again the Japanese don't feel they have to or that it is economically feasible for them to do so, something about too small a market to compete among themselves and the Europeans.  They just as soon cede that part of the market to them.

Bryant also makes a good point as an example, the last factory 999 WSBK was competitive with the inline 4 WSBK racers but was so highly tuned that they felt the reliability of the race motors were suspect so the 999 for the rest of us is less highly tuned.

Finally, as Ducatis become "more affordable" as an initial purchase, more people discover the brand and decide if they like the way the bike "performs".  It should never be about straight line speed or HP ratings because even today's inline 4 will be quickly eclipsed on the spec sheet by tomorrow's inline 4.  The product cycle is so short that you won't have the best, at least not long enough to enjoy it.  Ducati will never win that contest at the price the Japanese can crank them out. 

My battery operated Citizen watch is more accurate than a wind up big bucks automatic watch but one is a time piece and the other keeps time.

In the end, some people who buy Ducatis decide it is not the bike for them for a variety of reasons while others stay and collect an assortment of them "pair and a spare".  Some will hedge their bets and buy a more "reliable" bike as a backup.  To each his own. 

I am in awe of the japanese inline 4 but I love my Ducs, even the unglamorous ST4S which performed well during the AR trip, despite the clutch problem.

cdc

[pipeliner1978]

thanks for clearing that up chuck!
everyone on the forum, make no mistake, I love my ducs and want more.  I just like motorcycles, all kinds.