Electric Motorcycles: Why?

[IRISH]

What the hell do you call the things?

I've always referred to me monster and vette as "toys that go BANG." Elec bikes don't fit that descrip no more.

[PhilB]

that's a misleading assertion -- electric motors have been developed over the last 100 years.  applying that know-how to motorcycles piggybacks on the developments of ICE-based bikes. 

its not as if there are half a dozen styles of electric motor.  they are all basically the same thing, with minor differences for AC or DC. 

gas engines have wide differences in design.  electrics absolutely have an advantage due to simplicity.

This.

Also note that the electric TT goes for one lap, and that's that.

PhilB

[ducatiz]

What the hell do you call the things?

I've always referred to me monster and vette as "toys that go BANG." Elec bikes don't fit that descrip no more.

"Toys what go ZZZZAAAAP?"

Jacob's ladder

[Raux]

ask and you shall see.

One electric plug in car, being charged by a gas generator

[xcaptainxbloodx]

that's a misleading assertion -- electric motors have been developed over the last 100 years.  applying that know-how to motorcycles piggybacks on the developments of ICE-based bikes. 

its not as if there are half a dozen styles of electric motor.  they are all basically the same thing, with minor differences for AC or DC. 

gas engines have wide differences in design.  electrics absolutely have an advantage due to simplicity.

you make it sound like each bike is a standard chassis with a standard electric motor with a standard of stacking batteries.

each bike is running different drive systems, in different configerations.  they also have varying numbers and types of batteries and motors, some bikes "shift", some have regenerative braking, chassis design.. even the batteries themselves are different between bikes, varying not only in manufacture and material but also in the way they deliver that energy to the motor(s).

you wont find specifics on how different each bike is because those differences are all very closely guarded secrets. motoczsyz, for instance, uses the EP1C to show off their proprietary drive system, not to sell bikes.

Im not trying to claim that electric bikes are better because they are developing faster, or that they faced the same challenges as the early combustion bikes. I was more trying to show how quickly they've caught up. at the first TTGXP many bikes didnt make it to the starting line, of the ones that did few of them even finished.  and now 4 years later they've cracked the ton with a full grid.

[ducatiz]

you make it sound like each bike is a standard chassis with a standard electric motor with a standard of stacking batteries.

each bike is running different drive systems, in different configerations.  they also have varying numbers and types of batteries and motors, some bikes "shift", some have regenerative braking, chassis design.. even the batteries themselves are different between bikes, varying not only in manufacture and material but also in the way they deliver that energy to the motor(s).

you wont find specifics on how different each bike is because those differences are all very closely guarded secrets. motoczsyz, for instance, uses the EP1C to show off their proprietary drive system, not to sell bikes.

Im not trying to claim that electric bikes are better because they are developing faster, or that they faced the same challenges as the early combustion bikes. I was more trying to show how quickly they've caught up. at the first TTGXP many bikes didnt make it to the starting line, of the ones that did few of them even finished.  and now 4 years later they've cracked the ton with a full grid.

I hear you, but a lot of that is piggybacking from automotive development -- also the fact that CAD for cars/bikes has changed exceptionally in the last 20 years -- even 25 years ago, cars were still being modeled manually.  Now, they can generate a 3d model in a computer and design everything virtually.

I am just saying the apparently quick time-to-field for electric bikes has more to do with stuff behind the scenes and have been able to borrow a LOT from prior art.  Almost all of motorcycling over the last 100 years has been "this is brand new, let's see how it works" (carbon fibre frame-less bike anyone?)

[Randimus Maximus]

I'm too bored to read through the previous six pages.

Instant torque is a win!

In many cases, electrical power is less expensive than gas (excluding debates on coal vs. nuclear vs. hydro., etc).

[SDRider]

I'm too bored to read through the previous six pages.

Instant torque is a win!

In many cases, electrical power is less expensive than gas (excluding debates on coal vs. nuclear vs. hydro., etc).

You aren't missing much.

[pitbull]

If they can eventually design an electric motorcycle that would have a light enough battery with a long charge for touring, I would definitely be in.

The idea of touring through......say the colorado rockies, making very little noise would enhance the beauty of the surroundings and the peacefulness for me.



maybe I'm just getting old, but I'm even getting starting to think the roadracing exhaust on my monster is much too loud

[MendoDave]

If they can eventually design an electric motorcycle that would have a light enough battery with a long charge for touring, I would definitely be in.

The idea of touring through......say the colorado rockies, making very little noise would enhance the beauty of the surroundings and the peacefulness for me.



maybe I'm just getting old, but I'm even getting starting to think the roadracing exhaust on my monster is much too loud

I put the baffles back in on my Monster. It runs better now too.

[ducatiz]

If they can eventually design an electric motorcycle that would have a light enough battery with a long charge for touring, I would definitely be in.

The idea of touring through......say the colorado rockies, making very little noise would enhance the beauty of the surroundings and the peacefulness for me.

you would just fall asleep and run off the road... see?  quiet bikes = dangerous

[ManaloEA]

There are really two main issues (in my opinion) with current technology and design of electric motorcycles.

First is the shape of the batteries. It seems that battery manufacturers think in squares and blocks. However fitting squares into motorcycle frames does not make efficient use of the space. It is for this reason that we do not see square engine blocks in ICE bikes. If batteries could be custom made from a bunch of smaller cells, and assembled in a honeycomb configuration, this would allow custom configurations and shapes.

The second issue is with the electric motor. The current philosophy assumes that the motor has to be under the seat of the bike, and have a chain to drive the rear wheel. This takes up valuable space for power cells. For this reason, a hub motor based either on a pancake motor or a rail motor would be more efficient use of space.

[pitbull]

I put the baffles back in on my Monster. It runs better now too.

I put baffles into my RR exhaust aswell and it's taken it from 'drown out every harley on the road to barely tolerable'/

[pitbull]

you would just fall asleep and run off the road... see?  quiet bikes = dangerous

well it would certainly put my girlfrien to sleep more quickly. She can't stay awake on the back of my bike as it is now.

[xcaptainxbloodx]

I hear you, but a lot of that is piggybacking from automotive development -- also the fact that CAD for cars/bikes has changed exceptionally in the last 20 years -- even 25 years ago, cars were still being modeled manually.  Now, they can generate a 3d model in a computer and design everything virtually.

I am just saying the apparently quick time-to-field for electric bikes has more to do with stuff behind the scenes and have been able to borrow a LOT from prior art.  Almost all of motorcycling over the last 100 years has been "this is brand new, let's see how it works" (carbon fibre frame-less bike anyone?)

I guess im just not really concerned with how or why its happening then with the fact that its happening at all. I dont see how that part is relevant to whether or not electric motorcycles make sense.

am I reading you wrong? it reads to me like the E-bikes are somehow not earning what they have because theyve been able to take advantage of development in previous arenas. no matter how theyre doing it, its impressive and if they can garner the knowledge already being used to create an entirely new form propulsion and get it stable, competitive, durable and onto the street in consumer hands in under a decade then they deserve to be commended for that.

the bikes may seem like a silly waste of time by a bunch of green hippies now, but gurantee if they cracked that nut and you could have a 100% torque all the time, 180mph top speed, proper handling E-bike I think all the joking would die off pretty damn quick.