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Eco-Welder Feedback?

Started by triangleforge, October 03, 2011, 10:26:29 AM

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triangleforge

October 03, 2011, 10:26:29 AM
I'm just starting to look at plasma cutters, and came across this alternative: http://www.ecowelder.com/

It does both cutting up to 3/8" as well as welding with a fill rod. From what I can see in the videos & other materials on the site, it looks like the pros are portability, versatility & economical operation compared with other methods, while on the con side welding & cutting operations seem a lot slower (in the videos) than with comparable 220 wire-feed or stick welders & plasma cutters, and the gun seems pretty bulky compared to those.

Does anyone have any hands-on experience with this tool that they care to share?
By hammer and hand all arts do stand.
2000 Cagiva Gran Canyon

ducatiz

#1
October 03, 2011, 10:43:45 AM
mmm... for a tool of that caliber (size, use) $2k is a lot of coin.  one can pick up flux wire welders for around $100 nowadays and gas torch cutters are cheap.

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"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

ManaloEA

#2
October 03, 2011, 02:26:39 PM
Curious whether the unit (for a professional welding shop) would pay for itself over time in the reduced cost of fuel and other gasses. Interesting concept... kinda like the Brown's Gas welder.
2011 M696

ducpainter

#3
October 03, 2011, 04:53:08 PM
Quote from: ducatiz on October 03, 2011, 10:43:45 AM
mmm... for a tool of that caliber (size, use) $2k is a lot of coin.  one can pick up flux wire welders for around $100 nowadays and gas torch cutters are cheap.


a hundred dollar flux core mig isn't gonna weld 3/8" +
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent.”


ducatiz

#4
October 03, 2011, 06:48:24 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on October 03, 2011, 04:53:08 PM
a hundred dollar flux core mig isn't gonna weld 3/8" +

It's not, but for 200 bucks I can buy an oxy system too and I'm still 1700 under that price.
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

ducpainter

#5
October 04, 2011, 03:12:46 AM
Quote from: ducatiz on October 03, 2011, 06:48:24 PM
It's not, but for 200 bucks I can buy an oxy system too and I'm still 1700 under that price.
...and then lease/buy tanks...

It all depends on your requirements.

Personally I don't use flux core. If I want to wire feed I use bare and argon/co2.

I have a stick welder if I want to chip welds.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent.”


sno_duc

#6
October 04, 2011, 05:08:27 PM
The thing I'm wondering about is Hydrogen embrittlement, isn't that the reason you keep 7018 in a rod oven?
I scanned their website, they say a water / alcohol mix, both of which contain Hydrogen.
A conclusion is the place you got tired of thinking

ducatiz

#7
October 04, 2011, 07:12:48 PM
Quote from: sno_duc on October 04, 2011, 05:08:27 PM
The thing I'm wondering about is Hydrogen embrittlement, isn't that the reason you keep 7018 in a rod oven?
I scanned their website, they say a water / alcohol mix, both of which contain Hydrogen.

good point
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

ducpainter

#8
October 04, 2011, 07:26:17 PM
Quote from: sno_duc on October 04, 2011, 05:08:27 PM
The thing I'm wondering about is Hydrogen embrittlement, isn't that the reason you keep 7018 in a rod oven?
I scanned their website, they say a water / alcohol mix, both of which contain Hydrogen.
True...

if you're doing x-ray quality work you'd worry and keep your 7018 in an oven.

If the welder you're currently using is a flux core mig  then hydrogen embrittlement wasn't on your mind anyway.

How much free hydrogen is available when you combine water and alcohol and heat it to almost 15,000 degrees?

I think that other than the bulky torch it looks like a really compact/ lightweight alternative to carrying a buzzbox and a set of ox-acetylene tanks out in the field.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent.”


ducatiz

#9
October 04, 2011, 07:53:05 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on October 04, 2011, 07:26:17 PM


How much free hydrogen is available when you combine water and alcohol and heat it to almost 15,000 degrees?

a LOT.  both will be hydrolyzed almost immediately.  ethyl alcohol has 6 atoms of hydrogen and that will break almost immediately in heat.
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

ducpainter

#10
October 04, 2011, 07:55:47 PM
Quote from: ducatiz on October 04, 2011, 07:53:05 PM
a LOT.  both will be hydrolyzed almost immediately.  ethyl alcohol has 6 atoms of hydrogen and that will break almost immediately in heat.
I promise not to weld any bridges with it.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent.”


ducatiz

#11
October 04, 2011, 08:00:08 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on October 04, 2011, 07:55:47 PM
I promise not to weld any bridges with it.

I'm sure it works very well, do you have one?

meh, acid dip it and bake it for 3-4 hours.
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

ducpainter

#12
October 04, 2011, 08:11:04 PM
Quote from: ducatiz on October 04, 2011, 08:00:08 PM
I'm sure it works very well, do you have one?

meh, acid dip it and bake it for 3-4 hours.
I don't.

I do think it's a pretty neat rig.

It wouldn't be my choice for everything, but I think it would serve well for light fab work and most repair stuff.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent.”


Langanobob

#13
October 05, 2011, 08:00:50 AM
No FHE but before I'd buy that thing I'd ask the vendor if they can put you in touch with some local customers where you could see it first hand and get an idea of how well it's been working for them in the long term.

A quick Google search didn't turn up much of anything conclusive.

Bob

triangleforge

#14
October 05, 2011, 09:39:21 AM
At the bottom of their "Contact" page, they include an offer to "come to your office or residence to demonstrate the product in action" -- I'm guessing that just applies to the greater LA area (the US reseller appears to be based in Burbank); next time I'm in LA I might see if I can arrange to swing by & give it a try.

As I noted at the outset, I'm most interested in the cutting functions of any unit (I've done plenty of gas cutting, Z, and would rather do way less of it  :) ), while the ability to weld would be a nice side benefit - I've already got a little 115 Hobart (by Miller) GMAW & a bottle of Argon mix that does 99% of the welding I need, albeit more slowly & with more duty cycle breaks than a 220 welder would need. I've got access to those (as well as a plasma cutter & nicely outfitted shop) once a week when I work out of a friend's metal studio... or whenever I'm willing to make the hour drive down to his place.

As I've researched it a bit further, I'm finding a lot of off-brand plasma cutters that retail for under $1K also include leads & internals to also do TIG and stick welding as well - like this one: http://www.amazon.com/LTPDC2000-Lotos-Plasma-weekend-special/dp/B004ZZRM5W/ref=pd_cp_hi_2, though it's not surprising that the various online reviews of units like these are all over the map regarding the quality/usability of them. One thread that's universal in the reviews is that they might as well have left the manuals un-translated for all the help they provide.

Would I like to have a shop outfitted with a bank of pro-quality machines, each dedicated to a different function, and have the income to feed them all the gas, electricity and consumables they can eat? Well, duh. But that's not in the cards at the moment, and might not ever be.
By hammer and hand all arts do stand.
2000 Cagiva Gran Canyon
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