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that Old Tangerine Dream (problem bike these days... :( )

Started by MsTek, June 01, 2017, 06:46:42 AM

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Howie


DuciD03

Quote from: ducpainter on July 04, 2019, 08:57:37 AM
If you can source a metal filter, there is no need for the extra ground. The plastic filter is what necessitated the ground wire.

oh you again; I remember your problematic tangerine duc , still working on that machine ...lol.

... in general, as on computers; cars, motob's, etc; always make sure you have a good ground, or wires fuses blow or worse wires get burnt etc; ( ... and just thinking s little further ... your playing with a gas tank between your legs ...)

Test the components & wiring before reinstalling; knowing that takes a bit to get it out dry tec (but do not run the fuel pump dry for long it uses beinf submerged in gas to stay cool, (you could overheat the pump)

Don't think you need a new o ring on the tank / pump flange so long as it came off as a whole and goes on (Id lightly grease it then check for leaks; and you'll deff need the flange screws, and don't over tighten them you can crack the plastic in the tank; heed the torque warnings; not commenting on the electrical cause I don't have direct experience with wires on that component ...

.... all the world is yours.

stopintime

The flange screws are in the tank. That's where you at the time thought they were impossible to forget  [cheeky]
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

MsTek

I found the screws.  I used to lose everything when I was younger now I just put stuff away really well so I can't find it. ;)

I guess I will have to wait.  Damn.  I don't want to buy a car and that's a piece of crap too.  And I want a bike but I don't want to buy a new one.

Sometimes I wish I lived where there wasn't winter then I could get just get rid of the car!
"Do something each day that scares you..."

MsTek

Apparently the do it your self place burned down and there isn't another one in Chicago.

So I'm going to have to fix it myself or pay a shop money to make the repair for me. [bang]
"Do something each day that scares you..."

stopintime

Maybe find a shop that does electrical/computer/appliances work (cheaper) and hand them the printed wiring instructions you got here?

Then you can put the flange+ back in the tank yourself or pay a car shop (cheaper) to test and install it.
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it


MsTek

Quote from: stopintime on July 06, 2019, 02:12:32 AM
Maybe find a shop that does electrical/computer/appliances work (cheaper) and hand them the printed wiring instructions you got here?

Then you can put the flange+ back in the tank yourself or pay a car shop (cheaper) to test and install it.

Good idea!

Quote from: Dirty Duc on July 06, 2019, 09:21:37 PM
You fix computers, can you solder?

clip, put heat shrink on, solder, move heat shrink over bare wires, apply a lighter flame. Presto-change-o.
https://buyheatshrink.com/heatshrinktubing/high-temperature/teflon-ptfe-12/4-1-ptfe-heat-shrink?diameter=379&campaign=2052595882&adgroup=74495915517&feeditem=&keyword=&matchtype=&device=c&network=u&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjYHpBRC4ARIsAI-3GkGFFOQdQcRdBnUzSBfsmEheDDIAr0yM9HXcr82jljH89gnYIjE1DXIaAtJiEALw_wcB&creative=359650491566&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjYHpBRC4ARIsAI-3GkGFFOQdQcRdBnUzSBfsmEheDDIAr0yM9HXcr82jljH89gnYIjE1DXIaAtJiEALw_wcB

I cannot solder.  I don't fix computers like that.  I can build them and fix things wrong with them but I can't make a motherboard. :)
"Do something each day that scares you..."

S21FOLGORE

You don't have to solder.
If all you need to do is to add extra ground wire to the ground wire on the new harness, you can just "tap" extra ground wire to the ground wire of the new harness, using post-tap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N64p6ndlTQ8

https://www.amazon.com/Posi-tap-Connector-16-18-Gauge-Wire/dp/B00389R8KU

Dirty Duc

I was going to take video of soldering... it's easier and less problematic than the various pieces that exist to avoid it. I believe in standards, it's part of my job, but I doubt those Posi-lock things ability to hold up to Bonneville (salt-spray mil-spec).

But then I couldn't find the fancy thing that holds my cell phone to the tripod...

Seriously, though, if you can turn a wrench and troubleshoot a wsdl/dll/registry problem... soldering is just a matter of practice. This is more than you need:

https://www.amazon.com/Vastar-Soldering-Iron-Full-Welding/dp/B01712N5C4/ref=sxin_4_osp18-5bddfe5a_cov?ascsubtag=5bddfe5a-5f09-4448-804c-13db1e65e880&creativeASIN=B01712N5C4&cv_ct_id=amzn1.osp.5bddfe5a-5f09-4448-804c-13db1e65e880&cv_ct_pg=search&cv_ct_wn=osp-search&keywords=soldering+kit&linkCode=oas&pd_rd_i=B01712N5C4&pd_rd_r=ee6560a8-c7a4-4343-b477-1a4e8e340462&pd_rd_w=imomw&pd_rd_wg=UWqjA&pf_rd_p=c501273b-119a-4fc9-ad78-eda5006b0be9&pf_rd_r=CX0SZQGHHADZK4HTVK0J&qid=1562557994&s=gateway&tag=thewire06oa-20

https://www.amazon.com/SE-MZ101B-Helping-Hand-Magnifier/dp/B000RB38X8/ref=sr_1_29?keywords=soldering+kit&qid=1562558049&s=gateway&sr=8-29

It's not as delicate as making a motherboard... it's the neanderthal equivalent.

Howie

Unlike the more common 3M scotch locks the Posi-taps work pretty good.

In this case I think solder and heat shrink are the way to go.  I agree with Dirty Duc, you can do this, just practice first.  And don't use acid flux solder.

A couple of videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ErNVJytyNs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=325&v=ZuKFhBq7kog

The second one is more to show you can do this without a lot of equipment.  The lineman splice is overkill for what you are doing, and also bulky.

S21FOLGORE

In case you have never seen / used Posi-lock, posi-tap, they are not like those cheapo bullet connectors & vampire tapping connectors. They are totally in a different level.

If, she's willing to try soldering, I'd recommend "cordless" set up.

DSC03324

The black & silver thing in the foreground is my favorite, Weller /Portasol super-pro PSi100K. (cordless butane soldering iron)
The blue one in the back ground is Weller BP860MP, battery operated.

Portasol super-pro is way better tool, for working on vehicle wiring, security camera, etc. For those who don't have garage, Protasol has a huge advantage over corded soldering iron.
Also, it comes with PPT11 hot air deflector tip. (upper right corner)

DSC03322

This tip is for heat shrink tube. Again, when working on vehicle wiring, this is the easiest to use, most efficient tool.

Protasol super-pro PSI100K
https://www.amazon.com/PSI100K-Super-Pro-Self-Igniting-Cordless-Soldering/dp/B000ICGN38


If you don't want to spend that much money, this one will do. (This also comes with PTT11 tip.)
https://www.amazon.com/Weller-P2KC-Professional-Self-igniting-Soldering/dp/B000WOHSHM

For cleaning the tip, I recommend using those brass steel wool type one. Works better than wet sponge.

DSC03323

For cleaning

Dirty Duc

Quote from: howie on July 07, 2019, 10:38:19 PM
Unlike the more common 3M scotch locks the Posi-taps work pretty good.
Quote from: S21FOLGORE on July 08, 2019, 01:39:11 AM
In case you have never seen / used Posi-lock, posi-tap, they are not like those cheapo bullet connectors & vampire tapping connectors. They are totally in a different level.
They look pretty neat. I just doubt their long term petroleum resistance and their ability to keep out salt in the most extreme of conditions... I'd rather get my corrosion at the ends of the wires where I can see it.

Howie

Quote from: Dirty Duc on July 08, 2019, 05:43:49 PM
They look pretty neat. I just doubt their long term petroleum resistance and their ability to keep out salt in the most extreme of conditions... I'd rather get my corrosion at the ends of the wires where I can see it.

I'll agree with that.  Solder is the way to go on that fuel pump harness.

Speeddog

Motorcycles exist in a fundamentally hostile environment.
The wiring harness is completely exposed to that environment.
So anything you can do to make it more resistant to that is important.

The sealed connectors on Ducati harnesses are good, I see very little trouble with those.

The unsealed connectors are atrocious.
The spade connectors on the alternator and VR are an absolute crime, they're so under-spec that they're borderline when brand new.
Honestly, typical electrical/electronic designer ignorance of reality.
That also manifests itself in product packaging, I've seen countless aftermarket devices expressly for motos with no thought given to mounting.
They may as well just enclose the circuit board with shrinkwrap...oh, wait, that's real common too.

I'd not use that posi-lock inside a fuel tank.
The only connector they have that is immersion rated *at all* is the Posi-Tite, and that is only to SAE/USCAR-2 5.6.5.
Only 30 minutes immersion in gasoline, so not applicable to years-long immersion in ethanol-contaminated gasoline.

I've done a few of the ground-wire additions; snipped the ground wire off the defective harness and soldered it to the spade connector.
Never used heat shrink in that, I've no confidence whatsoever in it surviving immersed in gasoline.

I did 6 years of LSR competition at Bonneville and El Mirage.
The salt absolutely hammers everything, maintaining an operational wiring harness was a constant battle.
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